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Post by Elliot Kane on Oct 4, 2010 4:04:46 GMT
Even a few more Hayley fans is a good thing. I think we can definitely agree on that much  |
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Post by roger on Oct 4, 2010 8:32:38 GMT
That is true but unfortunately, the time spent in the US for the CW (and Il Divo) tours caused her popularity in the UK to be significantly diminished. Or so I am reliably informed. So overall, it did her no favours.  Roger |
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Post by milewalker on Oct 4, 2010 13:29:56 GMT
Hi Roger,
Well, at the very least her participation led to the fact that she was in the US not selling records. While she was here she was also not in the UK and therefore not promoting records
Jon
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Post by Libby on Oct 4, 2010 18:52:23 GMT
When I was scouring the concert threads (for earrings, of course!), I noticed quite a few good reactions to Hayley by Il Divo fans, and there definitely were some who said they went to buy her album in the lobby. Again, that's still just "a few" records sold, but at least it was in America and other European countries. They wouldn't have bought them if they hadn't seen her. But I can see that her touring with other artists here wasn't really that worthwhile overall. That's why she needs to come by herself. Of course I know not enough people know her to fill arenas, but I'm sure a few theaters here and there would be able to have her. If she never comes, she certainly won't get anywhere here, either. That's why a few TV appearances would help. It's really too bad she isn't in the Macy's parade. Well, I'm still hoping that she'll perform for the Mormon Tabernacle Choir's Christmas program some year... Wendy Long from Bedlam told me it was a good idea! But it won't work out this year, apparently. So maybe next year! In case you don't know much about Mormons, they have big families; therefore, there are a lot of them! i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gif |
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Post by martindn on Oct 4, 2010 19:33:38 GMT
Hi Chantelle and everyone Martin, Okay, I can understand enjoying Hayley purely (no pun intended!) based on the quality of her voice-- I used to be a real stickler for a "pretty" voice as well-- but as time goes by I am more and more forgiving of vocal imperfections as long as the music/message speaks to me. Not only do I love Sinatra & Streisand's voices-- it's their style that I TRULY love. And the same goes for someone like Billie Holiday-- her voice is honestly atrocious, but her *music* and passion is so exquisitely beautiful that I love it. Maybe that's a unique American aesthetic. We in America have our blues and our original "rock & roll" and our gospel and our rhythm & blues (not to be confused with modern R&B!) and our folk singers (Bob Dylan, anyone!?) where it wasn't so much the voice, but the music being performed that mattered. Just a thought. As I said, I completely see your point but from where I sit in America... it takes more than just a pretty voice.  Regarding considering Hayley "radical" in her material... Um, maybe I'm of this opinion because the US gets the dumbed-down versions of her albums, but really, how is the 1 millionth cover of "https://i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gifanny Boy" radical at all? Sorry, but that's just not something I'm interested in paying money to see in concert, no matter HOW brilliant the singer! Phew, where do I start? The thing about Hayley IS her voice for me. The fist time I saw her perform, I was in tears in 10 seconds. On stage she is truly mesmerising, you can't take your ears or eyes off her. I come away not believing that a mere singer could affect me the way she does. And it happens time after time. I agree that on paper, yet another performance of Danny Boy, or Ave Maria any of the other crossover classics, does not seem very inviting. But what if it is the best performance of Danny Boy you have ever heard? Would that be worth seeing? In fact, for me Danny Boy is wonderful when sung by Hayley, she can even make me love songs I used to hate, like Wuthering Heights. That's what I mean about the singer not the song. She can sing just about anything and it blows me away. Doesn't matter at all whether I like the song. It is probably hard to understand that unless you have seen (or perhaps some other truly great singer) Hayley live. She can take an ordinary song and make it great. I also think it is about what you expect from music, or how you listen to it. Music can appeal to us on four levels, the physical, the emotional, the intellectual and the spiritual. Or any combination of them, and the thing is that different singers appeal to different combinations. Someone like Bob Dylan appeals primarily to the intellect, whilst Micheal Jackson appeals to the physical. Much of American country music is emotional (or sentimental). As for Hayley, she appeals to the emotions too to some extent, but her music is overwhelmingly spiritual for me. So it won't have the intellectual appeal of Dylan (if there is any intellectual appeal at all it comes from her high technical standard of singing, something you could never accuse Dylan of - some of her vocal techniques are amazing, but thats another issue), or the dancabilty of Jackson. But that simply doesn't matter. You enjoy her music in a completely different way. And that is why I say she is radical. Most pop music depends on its physical or emotional appeal, the better stuff might have some intellectual content. Hayley's music is more like a sunset, or a rainbow (see my tag line) or a beautiful landscape. It just is, and no matter how many times you hear it, you never tire of it. You could drown in it, and die happy! Some classical and sacred music attempts to do a similar job, but for me Hayley just blows them all away. It is as if she opens a window into heaven. So if you are looking for intellectual content, for interesting and original songs or arrangements, you will have limited success with Hayley. She does try to be a bit different, with her Maori and Japanese songs and her own compositions, but that is not what she is primarily about. Hayley's music has timeless beauty. It would be beautiful in any place and any age. It is unaffected by what is fashionable, not trying to be trendy. It is not trying particularly to be original. It is not designed to make you think or dance. It simply IS. But to get back on topic, that is not something that everyone seems to be able to understand. It is no accident I think that so many of her fans are practicing Christians, people who are aware of the spiritual dimension of life. I'm sure there are many such people in America, supposedly the most Christian country in the world, and so she must have a market amoung people who would understand and love her if they knew she existed. Martin D |
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Post by milewalker on Oct 4, 2010 20:23:57 GMT
Martin,
From an American perspective, there is simply nothing about Hayley unique enough to make her stand out on its merit alone. A lot of people would agree she has a beautiful voice - but lots of people have beautiful voices and they arent stars either. How big of an objective difference is there between Hayley and Meav from CW? Or Lisa Kelly? That is the real problem with Hayley and CW, and also the problem with your argument. You and I may feel she is better than the others, but many people also prefer the others. Doesnt that suggest that there isnt a whole lot to separate them from an objective basis? The American market is glutted with singers like that. Hayley might really be better than they are - but if the difference isnt great enough to make her stand out in the popular mind, what good does that do.
She has been on the "Hour of Power" three times. I dont generally watch the show, but it is a fairly high profile national Christian show. It did nothing tangible for her. Once again, I just dont think that the perception of her talent over here is that special.
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Post by martindn on Oct 4, 2010 21:07:25 GMT
Hi Jon,
Yes, I think that's the problem. America has plenty of home grown singers with great voices, no need to import anyone.
I can say without any doubt at all that to my ears Hayley is the finest singer I have ever heard. And I have heard lots of singers, with big reputations in some cases, but Hayley is simply the best there is. But that od course is all about my subjective impression. In fact even I discovered Hayley quite by accident. If it hadn't been for her support act, I would probably never have gone to see her live either. It was only when I did that, that I realised she is something special.
So how do you persuade people she is worth going to see? I have no doubt that anyone who does see her will never regret it, but they have to be motivated to go in the first place. And since her records and videos have never really done her justice, how would they find out?
It's a problem I agree, and I don't know what the answer is.
Martin D
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Post by comet on Oct 4, 2010 22:33:47 GMT
Maybe Hayley should do a prisons tour like Johnny Cash !
She would have a captive audience.
But leave out the Shenandoah joke !
"All the doors are locked "
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Post by tracy on Oct 4, 2010 23:09:11 GMT
Maybe Hayley should do a prisons tour like Johnny Cash ! She would have a captive audience. But leave out the Shenandoah joke ! "All the doors are locked " Can I ask what the Shenandoah joke is? I love that song and Hayley's rendition is perfect. much love Tracy. |
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Joe
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Supporting Hayley since 2003!
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Post by Joe on Oct 5, 2010 0:33:54 GMT
Maybe Hayley should do a prisons tour like Johnny Cash ! She would have a captive audience. But leave out the Shenandoah joke ! "All the doors are locked " Can I ask what the Shenandoah joke is? Hello Tracy  During Hayley's concerts, if she is introducing her next song as 'Shenandoah' to her audience, it's sort of a tradition that Hayley mentions that there are 100 verses of 'Shenandoah', and that all the theatre doors are locked! Meaning that it's going to be a long night! She will then add more to the joke by saying "OK, I'll sing only 99 verses" or "I'll just sing the first three then". Actually the song (depending on how it is adapted) has only a handful of verses, If Hayley sang 'Shenandoah' during her last performance in America (July 4 2008) for an Independence Day TV special. She's got the capabillity to make this her signature song here in the states Best wishes Tracy, Joe |
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Post by scoobedoo on Oct 5, 2010 1:28:49 GMT
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Post by Libby on Oct 5, 2010 4:33:48 GMT
Joe, thanks for explaining. I've seen the joke mentioned plenty of times in concert threads, but I never knew till now what she meant by "the doors are locked". I thought that meant she wasn't allowed to sing all of them for some reason! Milewalker, Hayley's appearances on Hour of Power may not have gotten her very far, either. But if you watch, you see she gets a standing ovation! You can't say that they didn't appreciate her talent. Dr. Schuller obviously does, too. Her CDs are even sold on the website! I don't think the show is that widely watched. Not as much as the Macy's Day Parade. As for how Hayley is different from the other CW members, past and present, she only holds the title of the best-selling classical artist of the 21st century! None of the other members have accomplished that. |
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Post by tracy on Oct 5, 2010 12:12:25 GMT
Can I ask what the Shenandoah joke is? Hello Tracy During Hayley's concerts, if she is introducing her next song as 'Shenandoah' to her audience, it's sort of a tradition that Hayley mentions that there are 100 verses of 'Shenandoah', and that all the theatre doors are locked! Meaning that it's going to be a long night! She will then add more to the joke by saying "OK, I'll sing only 99 verses" or "I'll just sing the first three then". Actually the song (depending on how it is adapted) has only a handful of verses, If Hayley sang 'Shenandoah' during her last performance in America (July 4 2008) for an Independence Day TV special. She's got the capabillity to make this her signature song here in the states Best wishes Tracy, Joe Thanks Joe. I had no idea there where that many verses in the song and would love to hear the full version; to be honest I think I could quite happily sit through all 100 verses of Shenandoah if Hayley was singing it live. She certainly wouldn't have to lock me in. much love Tracy. |
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Post by milewalker on Oct 5, 2010 13:14:27 GMT
Joe, thanks for explaining. I've seen the joke mentioned plenty of times in concert threads, but I never knew till now what she meant by "the doors are locked". I thought that meant she wasn't allowed to sing all of them for some reason! Milewalker, Hayley's appearances on Hour of Power may not have gotten her very far, either. But if you watch, you see she gets a standing ovation! You can't say that they didn't appreciate her talent. Dr. Schuller obviously does, too. Her CDs are even sold on the website! I don't think the show is that widely watched. Not as much as the Macy's Day Parade. As for how Hayley is different from the other CW members, past and present, she only holds the title of the best-selling classical artist of the 21st century! None of the other members have accomplished that. Libby, This thread is about her success or lack thereof in the US. Therefore isnt any consideration of her success outside of the US off topic? It may even be fair to say that while Lisa and Meav may have benefitted somewhat from Celtic Woman, the effect for Hayley overall was almost certainly a step backwards. Every day she spent here was a day she could have been spending in places where she might actually sell a few records. |
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Post by grant on Oct 5, 2010 17:32:31 GMT
Hi Tracy Thanks Joe.
I had no idea there where that many verses in the song and would love to hear the full version; to be honest I think I could quite happily sit through all 100 verses of Shenandoah if Hayley was singing it live.
She certainly wouldn't have to lock me in.
much love Tracy. To expand on what Joe has already said; the reason why there seems to be so many verses appears to come from the fact that sailors would add their own as they moved about the ship doing their various duties such that it never mattered how long they all took to sing! I actually agree with you and would have no problem sitting through the lot, although when I asked Hayley she was very cagey about how many verses she actually knows The comment Joe made about 99 verses also stems from a conversation I and several other members had with Hayley after a concert when she commented that she thought that that particular joke was getting stale as everyone was getting to know it. I suggested that next time she said it, I should chip in with "Just sing 99 then", which Hayley thought quite amusing, so I did i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gif At the next concert, I was ready with my line but Hayley beat me to it and said it first!  I was quite flattered really. Lots of Love Grant |
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