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Post by tireman on Oct 9, 2011 23:40:12 GMT
First off, Jackie and Josh Groban are at all popular because they're both Americans, seems biased, but that's how it works. Secondly Jackie won(or was the runner up) of America's Got talent, a very famous show, so it's the mindset that, a person winning such a show 'should' be good. Which is why I feel, it is not the quality or the amount of promotions, but a big thing (event/movie/collaboration/whatever) should happen to help anything. Because ultimate quality is not going to change anything there, because Hayley will nevertheless put out her best. And making it any poppier would have no effect as well, because Hayley is initially 'not' a mainstream artist for them to listen to. So even if expensive promotion measures have been taken, hayley is still an unknown person to them. So I feel that as optimistically hoped by many of us here, if Hayley gets to sing in the movie Hobbit, or some Hans Zimmer collaboration on some movie, or collaboration with some other famous artist on a big event, it should help her get recognized better. But really nothing works by logic as far as the American market is concerned, so hopefully a miracle will happen, Hayley's always in my prayers to hit the stars  Please read my response to Susie. You just have to give the people what they want to hear. I'm sure I don't understand the tastes in your country anymore than you understand the tastes in mine. Larry |
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Dave
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HWI Admin
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Post by Dave on Oct 10, 2011 2:12:08 GMT
In my opinion Hayley's earlier forays into the U S were miserably mismanaged. Larry Hi Larry, Pure is the problem, as I explained a few posts back, and that was a Decca thing over which her former management would have had very limited input, they arrived on the scene quite late. As a foreign singer, I think you get one crack making it "big" in the US market and if you fail, that's usually the end of it (because if you don't crack it first time, you lose a lot of money in the effort). Many have tried, some far more popular than Hayley, and many have failed. Cheers, Dave |
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Post by Libby on Oct 10, 2011 4:23:41 GMT
Hi everyone, I see your point Larry about breaking into the US market and that would be great, however is it the type of music that is preventing this or simply lack of promotion? Obviously I don't know much about the american market and what sells well- it seems that Josh Groban sells really well and he sings more pop type songs, but then Jackie Evancho sings opera arias and so much more classical and she sells really well so it seems a bit confusing- does the usa market was an album more pop like than Paradiso? Katherine Jenkins last album Believe was much more pop like and I don't think that sold as well in America which suprised me beacuse I thought it would, so it could be that the problem is lack of exposure rather than the type of music- I may be wrong as like I said I don't know much about the USA market. Hi Susie Well Josh is an American and it may have been a help to him. I don't know anything about his management company. As far as K. Jenkins goes I think her voice is not suited to the U S tastes. I don't think she is as versatile as Hayley. She is much like U S opera starBeverly Sills. She used to appear on T V some years ago and sing pop songs and just didn't sound right. Just listen to Hayley's,Summer Fly, and you'll find no trace of classical nuances in her voice. Hence the difference between her and Jenkins. In my opinion Hayley's earlier forays into the U S were miserably mismanaged. I wouldn't look for Paradiso to make any headway in the U S. It's just not a marketable product here. Albeit the fact that I think it's a phenomenally great album. But I'm in the minority here. That's why I've traveled to the U K and Ireland six times since 2007. I suppose the only way to clarify the issue is to say ,When in Rome do as the Romans. Perhaps her former managers didn't understand that. Yeah, as some have pointed out, it was probably a mistake to have her sing Amazing Grace on Good Morning America. It's too overdone, even if she did sound beautiful. They should have had her sing WPTMB?, or even Pokarekare Ana, just because it was so different and "exotic". There were a number of things that led to Josh Groban's huge popularity. First, he had David Foster, the "hit man". Next, he filled in for Andrea Bocelli to sing The Prayer with Celine Dion. Then he was on Ally McBeal. That was really the big thing that got him started, because everyone wanted to know who that amazing singer was on the show. Next, it was Oprah. She had him on her show numerous times, and even had him be one of her "Favorite Things" at Christmas time, when his Christmas album came out. He did a couple movie soundtracks, too, but none of them were for very big movies. Katherine Jenkins seems kind of dull to me. Actually, when she sang with Jackie Evancho at the Rockefeller Center last year, she and Jackie sounded very similar. But the difference is, of course, she's from the UK and Jackie is American, but also it's because Jackie is a little girl, so it's more amazing for her to sing that way. It's not very amazing to hear a grown woman sing that way. I think for anyone to have been appealed to KJ would be for them to already love that type of music and singing and/or like other CC artists, as is true for many of us here. The same thing could probably be said of Hayley too, to some extent, but as you said, Larry, she is able to sing many different styles, quite effectively, too. She doesn't really sound operatic, whereas KJ sounds operatic. One song of hers I tried to listen to, I could barely understand anything she said, because it sounded as though she was yawning the whole time. Jackie does that too. That seems to be the problem with some classically trained singers. They're so well-trained, that they don't sound one bit natural. And remember, Hayley has her Celtic Woman fans, too. |
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Post by Libby on Oct 10, 2011 4:39:48 GMT
Simba, The Hobbit would help Hayley in more places than just the U.S., because Tolkien/LOTR is popular all around the world. Hayley's voice would be heard in theaters all around the world. Then she might have the opportunity to sing on the Academy awards show, as both Enya and Annie Lennox did. Then, people who buy the soundtrack would get to hear her, too. |
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Post by martindn on Oct 10, 2011 14:24:01 GMT
I think this is starting to drift off topic - so might need moving somewhere else.
I can't claim to know much about the American market - but one thing I can do is look at the artists that DID make it big over there and see what they have in common.
I think Simba is right when he says that being American is a huge help. Americans seem to love their home-grown talent. Perhaps they regard Canadian as almost home-grown, which covers Dion and Buble. If there is enough of that why look elsewhere. And I'm sure there is plenty.
So what do foreign artists have to do to make it in America? There don't seem to be many that do. Many more seem to fail than succeed.
The Beatles were perhaps the biggest foreign success of recent decades. Are any of you old enough to remember how they were promoted? And why they had more success than the home-grown Beach Boys for example?
I also notice that many American artists get known through TV and Movies - that happens here too but is perhaps more pronounced in America. I think it is true that the mass market is more influenced by image than quality anyway. I have heard some appalling singers who have sold shedloads of records - becuse of an appealing image. If they can sing well too (like little Jackie or Streisand) it helps I'm sure, but if needs be with the right image that can be dispensed with.
Hayley has no image in America. She is just one beautiful young lady singer among many, and there are plenty of those that are American. I suspect that a lot of Pure's success over there was the fact that nobody else had sung Maori songs to them before. Paradiso contains no Maori songs - so that won't help sell it. There is nothing remotely connected to New Zealand on Paradiso. So she can't sell it on the NZ ticket.
In that respect, as far as "image" goes, Paradiso is quite weak. I agree that musically it is superb - but I am a person that puts the music first, and I think that is unusual in the mass markets both here and in the US.
Hayley's people could spend a lot of money promoting Hayley in America. But my gut feeling is that she needs a distinctive image to promote that is her own - and although I hate to be negative about this - Pasradiso's image is perhaps more Morricone and Italy/Rome than Hayley. I'm not sure that is enough to impress most Americans, despite the wonderful music.
I'd be delighted if the Americans here can tell me I'm wrong. But I fear I might not be.
Martin D
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Post by Simba on Oct 10, 2011 15:29:51 GMT
Very well said Martin, you nailed it all by just saying it's the 'image' over 'quality' and quality helps. But in the end, whether Paradiso does crack the American market or not is second, nor is it time wasted as previously mentioned. Hayley saw her dream come true (or one of her dreams!  Ennio may not be recognized by everyone, but his music is everywhere, everybody knows the music from his Spaghetti Western scores the moment they hear it, and it has been used as the typical 'cowboy' music, and to set such a trademark, is amazing. He's indeed a legend, and working with him has opened new doors for hayley. To have a person on higher grounds instructing her, pushing her to her limits, showed hayley she can even raise her voice to sound deeply emotional, with her couple of fiesty numbers. I mean my dad likes Hayley, but not as much as I do, but when I played Amalia por amor, he was astounded, he was like "Is that HAYLEY?!!?" and from a 'what a 'sweet' voice!' reaction, her voice has also gained the compliment of a 'bold' and 'powerful' voice. And hayley is likely to use all these new techniques to move forward. Overall to conclude the argument, which started by saying "Paradiso was a waste of time", no it wasn't. Many put it more wisely than me, but I'd like to reiterate it, Paradiso will live on for decades just as Ennio's music does, and to hear vocal arrangements of great instrumental pieces (that too in the best voice!) is a treasure indeed So happy Hayley got this opportunity and made Ennio's music complete with her beautiful voice. Whenever I listened to Ennio's music before, I always had the feeling of waiting for a voice to start, and now that's fulfilled with my favorite singer ever. And I strongly believe no matter how great(or not so great) the sales are, every collaboration with a people in great standards, marks Hayley's career as a singer. And I know for sure working with people like Ennio is more important for Hayley than cracking the American market (which is of great importance too). Don't want to backseat mod, but I think we have a topic regarding "cracking the American Market" or something....correct me if I'm wrong. Because this topic is beginning to have posts which are likely to be in that topic. |
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Martin
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HWI Management Team
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Post by Martin on Oct 10, 2011 15:47:34 GMT
I think this is starting to drift off topic - so might need moving somewhere else. Getting very close Martin!  Can we please keep this thread on topic for Paradiso. There are other boards/threads more appropriate for discussing Hayley's potential in the USA or indeed anywhere else. Thanks Martin |
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Post by tireman on Oct 25, 2011 2:14:38 GMT
Went to Wall Mart to see if they had Paradiso. None to be found but plenty of Susan Boyle.
I left in a huff without buying aanything. I have the NZ album ; but I wanted the U S album. Guess I'll have to go t Amazon.
Larry
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Post by Libby on Oct 25, 2011 6:39:50 GMT
You should've tried Barnes & Noble on the very day.  By now they might not have any left.  |
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Post by Bamafan on Dec 22, 2011 4:06:33 GMT
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Post by Richard on Dec 22, 2011 8:16:29 GMT
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Post by grant on Mar 24, 2012 15:13:38 GMT
Hello everyone I now have a US promotional copy of Paradiso, although the spelling on the CD itself is a bit off   Best wishes Grant |
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Joe
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Supporting Hayley since 2003!
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Post by Joe on Mar 24, 2012 16:56:52 GMT
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Post by grant on Mar 24, 2012 18:24:46 GMT
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Post by cloudbusting.heights on Mar 27, 2012 19:03:48 GMT
Hello everyone I now have a US promotional copy of Paradiso, although the spelling on the CD itself is a bit off Best wishes Grant Hold up now! How'd you find this? Ebay? How are promotional CDs distributed anyway? (Sorry if that's off topic  ) |
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Ennio may not be recognized by everyone, but his music is everywhere, everybody knows the music from his Spaghetti Western scores the moment they hear it, and it has been used as the typical 'cowboy' music, and to set such a trademark, is amazing. He's indeed a legend, and working with him has opened new doors for hayley. To have a person on higher grounds instructing her, pushing her to her limits, showed hayley she can even raise her voice to sound deeply emotional, with her couple of fiesty numbers. I mean my dad likes Hayley, but not as much as I do, but when I played Amalia por amor, he was astounded, he was like "Is that HAYLEY?!!?" and from a 'what a 'sweet' voice!' reaction, her voice has also gained the compliment of a 'bold' and 'powerful' voice. And hayley is likely to use all these new techniques to move forward. 
By now they might not have any left. 
)