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Post by tireman on Oct 6, 2011 20:06:53 GMT
I think this is Hayley's best album to date- I think Morricone really did push her compared to her earlier albums- which I do love as well. I think that the music industry is so obsessed with sales and obviously they need that to make money, but I think the music should come first and some artists sell a lot, but I don't think the music is great, but hayley always sticks to what she is good at and I think it would be worse if she just focused on sales rather that recording good music. Obviously everyone has a different opinion- personally I love this album. Hi Susie First I believe that Hayley is as serious about her music. Probably more serious than most artists. However having said that I raise the question as to why she shouldn't be entitled to monetary compensation. Would you work for nothing just because you like your job. Do you think artists like Hayley don't have expenses. I can't name an artist that works Any harder than Hayley. Even to the detriment of her own health. Susie our appreciation and accolades do not pay her bills. Many artists make a lot of money although their talent is very thin. But what they do is give the people what they want to hear.Is that a bad thing? I don't think so. I am an avid fan of classical/crossover music; but I don't think IT will ever attain the kind of popularity with the age groups that spend the most money on music. So what would be the problem with Hayley keeping her roots in C/C but yet doing some concerts somewhat Streisand or Celine Dion. Hayley has the talent and the looks to succeed. That would open the door to the U S to her rather than getting snubbed when she came here for the Paradiso release. Hayley is more than capable to be good at any type of music. Larry |
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Post by Libby on Oct 7, 2011 5:52:24 GMT
Larry, I don't quite understand your comment about doing concerts "somewhat" Streisand and Celine Dion? I think you're missing a word there.
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Post by susieverity on Oct 7, 2011 10:19:12 GMT
I don't really want to argue about thins because its pointless- I'm not saying she shouldn't make money or that there is something wrong with artists that sell alot, I was simply making the point that sales alone do not make good music- just becasue something sells millions of copies does not mean it is good just because of that and therefore Paradiso may not be the best selling album of the year, but the music is amazing. I also agree that Hayley is good at any type of music I would listen to her sing anything.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Oct 7, 2011 10:31:25 GMT
Hi Susie and all, I would just add that many of the singers, musicians and composers who are acknowledged to be the best in the World sell peanuts in terms of CD sales, with one or two exceptions for a few of them (including Hayley's 'Pure'). But being the best, e.g. having a beautiful voice and always singing or playing in tune like Hayley, are on their own not enough to satisfy most people as there's a lot more to music than that. But as long as there is a enough of a potential niche audience they can make a good living by doing concerts and making personal appearances and collaborations, aimed at their fan bases, just like Hayley. With an occasional charity event thrown in, of course. So I agree, selling truckloads of CDs isn't the be all and end all of having a successful and long lasting music career - though it is I suspect an easier way of making a living.  Cheers, Dave |
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Post by susieverity on Oct 7, 2011 10:45:23 GMT
I totally agree Dave- you put it much better than me- Hayley is amazing live, I wish I was able to make it to the paradiso tour, but unfortunately I'm not free on the day for the cliffs pavillion which is closest to me- hopefully i can see her live again in the future. I think the bottom line here is that we are all hayley fans and support her.
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Post by tireman on Oct 7, 2011 18:36:14 GMT
Hi Libby
The reason I've said what I've been saying is that I really believe Hayley or her managers should put more effort into cracking the American market. To fully get the recognition she deserves she needs to make it there.
In Hayley's book, Hayley Westenra....In her own words she says on page160 paragraph 3, " Breaking America is the holy grail for any recording artist, and managers tend to spend a lot off their waking hours looking for opportunities to perform in front of American audiences".
Morricone is an icon in many countries but not here. Not to say that she didn't profit from working with him ; but also she spent a year of her life doing it. Now the U S is GA GA for little Jackie Evanco and that makes it even more difficult to break in with C/C music. I think the largest western country in the world should have the same opportunity to here this phenomenal of Hayley's in person as well as anyone.
That's my opinion and if you believe Hayley's own words I think I'm right.
Larry
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Post by cloudbusting.heights on Oct 7, 2011 20:36:59 GMT
Hi Libby The reason I've said what I've been saying is that I really believe Hayley or her managers should put more effort into cracking the American market. To fully get the recognition she deserves she needs to make it there. In Hayley's book, Hayley Westenra....In her own words she says on page160 paragraph 3, " Breaking America is the holy grail for any recording artist, and managers tend to spend a lot off their waking hours looking for opportunities to perform in front of American audiences". Morricone is an icon in many countries but not here. Not to say that she didn't profit from working with him ; but also she spent a year of her life doing it. Now the U S is GA GA for little Jackie Evanco and that makes it even more difficult to break in with C/C music. I think the largest western country in the world should have the same opportunity to here this phenomenal of Hayley's in person as well as anyone. That's my opinion and if you believe Hayley's own words I think I'm right. Larry I agree with you Larry. You said it better than I would have been able to-what with my impatience and temper getting in the way  Happy Autumn, Paige |
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Post by Libby on Oct 8, 2011 4:48:06 GMT
I still don't understand what you were saying about Celine Dion and Barbra Streisand. I mean your wording. I do not understand what you're saying Hayley should do like them. That is all I was asking.
As for Jackie Evancho, I would think that she would be helping, not hurting, Hayley here. She's helping to bring the genre of CC to the attention of more Americans. And she has said before that Hayley is one of her favorite singers/inspirations, AND she has sung at least 1 or 2 of her songs! When people search for Jackie singing Dark Waltz (which I can't handle, by the way), youtube will probably show links to Hayley's version, too, and who knows, they might listen to it and like it better than Jackie's (because it really is hundreds of times better).
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Post by tireman on Oct 8, 2011 14:39:02 GMT
I still don't understand what you were saying about Celine Dion and Barbra Streisand. I mean your wording. I do not understand what you're saying Hayley should do like them. That is all I was asking. As for Jackie Evancho, I would think that she would be helping, not hurting, Hayley here. She's helping to bring the genre of CC to the attention of more Americans. And she has said before that Hayley is one of her favorite singers/inspirations, AND she has sung at least 1 or 2 of her songs! When people search for Jackie singing Dark Waltz (which I can't handle, by the way), youtube will probably show links to Hayley's version, too, and who knows, they might listen to it and like it better than Jackie's (because it really is hundreds of times better). Libby, I didn't mean for Hayley to imitate them. I just think Hayley could sing certain songs with her unique vocal talents and make them more appealing to American audiences, That's what gained Babs fame. Same songs sung better than other artists. Hayley like Babs has such a unique listenable quality to her voice that I really believe she could be a hit. In particular with the songs that most artists won't sing because they don't possess the ability to sing them well. Songs that require an ability to sing in the ranges that some wouldn't dare attempt. Larry |
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Post by Libby on Oct 9, 2011 5:53:41 GMT
Such as?
Hayley has expressed more than once her interest in collaborating with Barbra. Of course now she always just says Michael Buble, or Mumford & Sons, whoever they are.
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Post by Elliot Kane on Oct 9, 2011 8:11:34 GMT
Hi Libby The reason I've said what I've been saying is that I really believe Hayley or her managers should put more effort into cracking the American market. To fully get the recognition she deserves she needs to make it there. In Hayley's book, Hayley Westenra....In her own words she says on page160 paragraph 3, " Breaking America is the holy grail for any recording artist, and managers tend to spend a lot off their waking hours looking for opportunities to perform in front of American audiences". Morricone is an icon in many countries but not here. Not to say that she didn't profit from working with him ; but also she spent a year of her life doing it. Now the U S is GA GA for little Jackie Evanco and that makes it even more difficult to break in with C/C music. I think the largest western country in the world should have the same opportunity to here this phenomenal of Hayley's in person as well as anyone. That's my opinion and if you believe Hayley's own words I think I'm right. Larry Cracking America is great for any artist, sure, but that doesn't mean they should turn their every waking moment to winning over Americans when they already have a worldwide audience. Neglecting current fans loses you the money you're living on now for no certain gains. I suspect Hayley's reasoning is that she will make the very best album she possibly could, then try to increase her audiences worldwide with that. And given the sheer quality of Paradiso, I'd say that's exactly what she's done. It's pretty clear Americans aren't opposed to Classical Crossover in principle. The successes of Susan Boyle and Jackie Evancho prove that. It's just harder to get their attention is all... |
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Oct 9, 2011 13:08:07 GMT
Of course, Decca made a huge effort to break into the US with Hayley and Pure, and they got their fingers (and bank balances) burnt. Hayley has suffered ever since because of their mis-judgement and I don't think either Decca or Hayley will be risking anything similar anytime soon. It probably explains why more (expensive) promotional effort was not made for Paradiso. I know that's not good news but perhaps it will explain things better for anyone who doesn't know the history. Many far bigger acts than Hayley have tried and failed to "crack" America but of course, like Hayley, that doesn't stop them from releasing their albums in the US with limited promotion, for the benefit of what may have to remain a "niche" fanbase.  I think that even in the UK, Hayley's music is far from mainstream, NZ is perhaps the only place where that would apply. Cheers, Dave |
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Post by susieverity on Oct 9, 2011 14:00:20 GMT
Hi everyone,
I see your point Larry about breaking into the US market and that would be great, however is it the type of music that is preventing this or simply lack of promotion? Obviously I don't know much about the american market and what sells well- it seems that Josh Groban sells really well and he sings more pop type songs, but then Jackie Evancho sings opera arias and so much more classical and she sells really well so it seems a bit confusing- does the usa market was an album more pop like than Paradiso? Katherine Jenkins last album Believe was much more pop like and I don't think that sold as well in America which suprised me beacuse I thought it would, so it could be that the problem is lack of exposure rather than the type of music- I may be wrong as like I said I don't know much about the USA market.
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Post by Simba on Oct 9, 2011 15:56:13 GMT
First off, Jackie and Josh Groban are at all popular because they're both Americans, seems biased, but that's how it works. Secondly Jackie won(or was the runner up) of America's Got talent, a very famous show, so it's the mindset that, a person winning such a show 'should' be good. Which is why I feel, it is not the quality or the amount of promotions, but a big thing (event/movie/collaboration/whatever) should happen to help anything. Because ultimate quality is not going to change anything there, because Hayley will nevertheless put out her best. And making it any poppier would have no effect as well, because Hayley is initially 'not' a mainstream artist for them to listen to. So even if expensive promotion measures have been taken, hayley is still an unknown person to them. So I feel that as optimistically hoped by many of us here, if Hayley gets to sing in the movie Hobbit, or some Hans Zimmer collaboration on some movie, or collaboration with some other famous artist on a big event, it should help her get recognized better. But really nothing works by logic as far as the American market is concerned, so hopefully a miracle will happen, Hayley's always in my prayers to hit the stars |
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Post by tireman on Oct 9, 2011 22:59:19 GMT
Hi everyone, I see your point Larry about breaking into the US market and that would be great, however is it the type of music that is preventing this or simply lack of promotion? Obviously I don't know much about the american market and what sells well- it seems that Josh Groban sells really well and he sings more pop type songs, but then Jackie Evancho sings opera arias and so much more classical and she sells really well so it seems a bit confusing- does the usa market was an album more pop like than Paradiso? Katherine Jenkins last album Believe was much more pop like and I don't think that sold as well in America which suprised me beacuse I thought it would, so it could be that the problem is lack of exposure rather than the type of music- I may be wrong as like I said I don't know much about the USA market. Hi Susie Well Josh is an American and it may have been a help to him. I don't know anything about his management company. As far as K. Jenkins goes I think her voice is not suited to the U S tastes. I don't think she is as versatile as Hayley. She is much like U S opera starBeverly Sills. She used to appear on T V some years ago and sing pop songs and just didn't sound right. Just listen to Hayley's,Summer Fly, and you'll find no trace of classical nuances in her voice. Hence the difference between her and Jenkins. In my opinion Hayley's earlier forays into the U S were miserably mismanaged. I wouldn't look for Paradiso to make any headway in the U S. It's just not a marketable product here. Albeit the fact that I think it's a phenomenally great album. But I'm in the minority here. That's why I've traveled to the U K and Ireland six times since 2007. I suppose the only way to clarify the issue is to say ,When in Rome do as the Romans. Perhaps her former managers didn't understand that. Larry |
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