Odyssey: which charts?

[Dave]

Well we now know enough about 13 of the 17 tracks Hayley recorded for Odyssey to work out which charts it is likely to appear in across the globe (thanks for the iclassics link Stephanie!).

The styles seem to be broadly similar to "Pure" with, probably, a few more "true classical" tracks, a handful of easy listening pop/showsong tracks and a couple in the middle. I assume that the two "original" tracks will be easy listening pop songs.

This means that like Pure, Odyssey will probably not qualify for the classical charts in Countries where the rules are very tight i.e. NZ, Germany, Japan;

and will qualify for the Classical Crossover Chart in the USA; and for the Classical Chart in: Australia and hopefully the UK. Australia looks easy but the UK classical chart is a bit of a problem. Why? Well, here's the tracklisting (Japan) as we now know it and you can see that as it is, it will NOT qualify in the UK (60% must be classical):

Known Tracks on Odyssey (Japan)			Pop or Classical

=======================================		=====================
The Prayer (Groban/Church, Bocelli/Dion?)	Pop (Quest for Camelot)
Ave Maria (Caccini).				Classical
Dell'Amore Non Si Sa (w/ Andrea Bocelli) 	Pop (“Andrea” pop album)
Never Saw Blue Like That (original song) 	Pop (probably)
What You Never Know (original song) 		Pop (probably)
Both Sides Now (Joni Mitchell)			Pop
Quanta Qualia (Patrick Hawes) 			Classical
May it Be (Lord of the Rings - Enya)		Pop (Classical?)
Aria Cantilena (Villa-Lobos)			Classical
From a Mozart Piano Concerto			Classical
Mozart’s Lullaby (Wiegenlied - Flies)		Classical
Dido's Lament: (Dido & Aeneas - Purcell) 	Classical

=======================================		======================


Bonus and extra tracks:				12 tracks above: 
						6 classical, 
I Say Grace (Japan bonus track?)		probably 6 pop.
Second Japan bonus track.	
Extra track 3					7/12 = 58%class, so Pop.
Extra track 4					7/13 = 53%class, so Pop.
Extra track 5					8/13 = 61%class, so Classical
========================			8/14 = 57%class, so Pop.

17 tracks recorded	

So... based on the UK classical chart rules (the same ones Zoe Mace, Andrea Bocelli and Russell Watson failed to meet with their last albums), Hayley needs to find two more classical songs for "Odyssey" out of the five we don't know anything about - and unless "May it Be" is counted as classical - one of the 6 "pop" songs will have to be dropped for the UK version. But... the balance of Odyssey looks perfect as it is, to me.

If Odyssey is perceived in the UK as being a pop album, I think it will get less overall airplay and lose sales - this is exactly what happened to Russell Watson recently and to a lesser extent, Andrea. But... many Hayley fans also love the "pop" songs that she sings and some prefer them.

Tricky problem is this, and I'm not at all sure what they should do about it Any ideas?

[kcuteus1]

what does it matter. with Russell Watson it was not just the fact that it did not make the classical chart it also has to do with he did not do as much promo and it took like two years for athouther cd but it is doing very well in other places and it did get to # 10 on the main Uk chart. It did better than Andrea in the Uk and it is not as poppy well i do not think it is very poppy it is kind of like how prue is I do not understand how that was put on the Uk classical chart. But these people do very well with there tours.

[kcuteus1]

But I also am someone that think it is not fear if these classical crossover singer on put on the Uk classical chart it makes it hard for the pure classical people to be put on it. The Uk needs a classical crossover chart because this is what these people on they are not pure classical and they are not pure pop well what I call prue pop. But I come from the US and I see things different. I think this is a maket that alot of these people have to chark and it is hard.

[kcuteus1]

But the time that Odyssey is being release in the USA the crossover chart is going to be inerreseing there is a lot of commpution some interesting classical crossover cds are going to be release here . I am a big fan of classical crossover. I do think it would do well on .

[Dave]

kcuteus1 said:

what does it matter. with Russell Watson it was not just the fact that it did not make the classical chart it also has to do with he did not do as much promo and it took like two years for athouther cd but it is doing very well in other places and it did get to # 10 on the main Uk chart. It did better than Andrea in the Uk and it is not as poppy well i do not think it is very poppy it is kind of like how prue is I do not understand how that was put on the Uk classical chart. But these people do very well with there tours.

Thanks for your comments kcuteus (I bet you could have said it all in one post if you'd thought about it first! ) What I meant about Andrea and Russell, and what worries me about Odyssey (in the UK) is this:

Andrea's previous UK release, Viaggio Italiano in 2003, sold about 220,000 copies in shops in that year; it was also in the classical charts. His latest (2004) release, Andrea, sold 97,000 copies in that year. Basically, it "bombed" and it may be no coincidence that it was *excluded* from the classical charts.

Russell Watson's previous UK release, Reprise in 2002, sold about 250,000 copies in shops in that year. His latest release, Amore Musica in 2004, sold 140,000 in that year. Basically, it also "bombed" (not quite as badly as Andrea's, I admit) but again, it may be no coincidence that it was *excluded* from the classical charts. The gap between Andrea's two releases was one year; between Russell's two releases was two years - the same as Hayley's.

I am not saying there aren't other reasons that help to explain their drop in sales but they are huge drops - and it makes me nervous. Of course, if Odyssey gets to no. 1 in the pop chart it won't matter much at all i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gif but I'd rather play safe so i hope there are a couple of good classical tracks in reserve - for the UK version anyway!

[kcuteus1]

I know I could of put it all in one post but I for got too put the other stuff. I am not to into sales as you are and as far as I know everyone has it where there sales drop but if Hayley it would not be that good because this is here 2nd cd in the Uk . But there is also tours and
other stuff some people like stuff more live than on cd.

But I will be more into how she does in the US but that is because I am from the US and I would like alot of these classical crossover singers to make it here . It is hard to do but with the right promo it can happen.

I am not to into sales of cd because I am into alot of un mainstian stuff .

And for anyone that whats to know my name is Kimberly

[stephch]

To be honest I like the tracklist the way it is but then again I do not really care if it is put on The UK classical chart as I live in the USA and I know it would make the crossover chart also I would like her make it in the USA as with all the other crossover artist that I like .But I can understand your worry as Pure sold over about 600,000 copie's in the UK in 2003 I do not think odyssey would do as good as there is a two year gap and she may not have the hype anymore.About drop in sale's it happen's with nearly everyone there are artist I can think of that had bigger drop's but then again these artist I am thinking of are pop artist not crossover artist .

[HWI]

I think that all the points made here are things that have been taken into account already by Decca and Hayley's people.

Pure was a huge success, breaking all records bar one in the UK (it reached number 7 in the pop charts here, being beaten only by Charlotte Church, who got to number 4).

This is one reason why so much time has been spent brainstorming which songs to record and which ones to be included on the album for the various countries. As Steve said at Hampton Court, the tracklisting for most of the countries was still not finalised as they worked on ensuring the album would qualify for the right chart in each country.

One thing they are very much aware of is the standard that was set by Pure. Making the wrong decision could seriously affect the sales figures and that could result in some people seeing Hayley as a "flash in the pan". Something we know is most definitely not the case. But, the attention of many is fairly transient so, if it is not in the charts (the wrong ones) for very long, it will disappear off the shelves in many places which only stock CD's which are in them. The result is that huge numbers of the public would forget about Hayley's new album and not buy it. Take a look at the Classic FM and Classical Artist charts for the UK - Pure has been in them for 92 consecutive weeks. That is phenomenal.

Personally, I want to see Odyssey do better than that. After all, Hayley deserves it. So, decisions aren't easy to make and, yes, it makes a huge difference which charts the album qualifies for. As the biggest share of the world sales for Pure have been in the UK, it is important to ensure Odyssey qualifies for the classical charts here.

Keith.

[Dave]

admin said:

I think that all the points made here are things that have been taken into account already by Decca and Hayley's people.

Thank you Keith, the voice of reason!

I just hope that Hayley and the Record Company are singing from the same Hymn sheet. I know what Hayley wants to do and also how determined she can be (as in her biography) so if there is another "battle", I know where I'd put my money.

There, I feel better already! i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gif

[stephch]

To be honest the most important chart should be the mainstream one .Alot of the stuff I tend to get is stuff that does not do very good but some of these people do very well live wise.Keedie is some one I really like and her album did not do that good and there are many other's I can think of but unlike hayley these people do not have to worry about what she does.Sadly more then hafe the stuff in the mainstream chart's I dislike so in a way chart's do not make me buy cd's.

[Richard]

Hello again Hayley fans everywhere!

I would like to see "Odyssey" do really well in all the charts it qualifies for. My big suggestion is for everybody to buy several copies in the first week it is released, one for yourself and the others as Christmas presents for all your friends and relations.

I bet you'll agree it's a good idea when Christmas approaches and you've got most of your shopping done weeks in advance! i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gif

Bye for now,

Richard,
aka Santa's Little Helper!

[stephch]

Alot of people buy more then one cd but sometime's it does not alway's help.I think one reason why pure did so good is that alot of people not from NZ and the UK got those release's.I know I would only get the USA release so I hope there are not much diffent version's as I have never understood the reason for that .I hope the USA release has mary did you know and the english version of bach/ground Ava Maria she did with her live in new zealand DVD.

[roger]

richnorri said:

My big suggestion is for everybody to buy several copies in the first week it is released, one for yourself and the others as Christmas presents for all your friends....


Bye for now,

Richard,
aka Santa's Little Helper!

Hi Richard,

I may owe you a coffee but if you think I'm going to start buying you Christmas presents......!

Anyway, I can't believe you'd wait that long!

Roger

[roger]

stephch said:

To be honest the most important chart should be the mainstream one .Alot of the stuff I tend to get is stuff that does not do very good but some of these people do very well live wise.Keedie is some one I really like and her album did not do that good and there are many other's I can think of but unlike hayley these people do not have to worry about what she does.Sadly more then hafe the stuff in the mainstream chart's I dislike so in a way chart's do not make me buy cd's.

Personally it doesn't matter to me which chart Hayley appears in but, from a commercial point of view, I feel that inclusion in the classical charts would be of greater benefit to Hayley. It comes down to a question of airplay. If it is in the classical charts, it will be played very regularly in the UK on Classic FM which has a weekly audience of 6.5 million. I am convinced that is what helped sales of 'Pure' more than anything.

In America, she may do better in the mainstream chart - I wouldn't know.

We'll buy it no matter where it appears, won't we?

Roger

[stephch]

Hayley does not do hafe as good with the US mainstream chart as she does with the UK we are a hard market to crack.