All Angels chart news

[Richard]

Hello folks!

Mark Goodyer played 'Angels' this morning, and that concluded the All Angels sessions after Pause for Thought on Radio 2 this week.

Best Wishes,

Richard

[nicola]

At Amazon, Katherine All Angels and Angelis have been swapping about in the rankings for a week now. At iTunes All Angels have been well ahead for over a week. The trouble is that Kathetrine and Angelis have better rack positions in the supermarkets (and two slots instead of one) so they are more visible. This seems to be enough to keep them just ahead.

I'm not having a pop at them or anything, just genuine disconcertation, but how are Angelis selling so well? I mean... they have nothing on Katherine or All Angels. It's... well... shocking.

[Dave]

Hello Nicola,

I think at this time of year many people who have very little musical knowledge (or taste!) are out Christmas shopping and browse the charts racks in stores for presents. Seeing something vaguely "classical crossover" at the top of the pop chart is unusual and will be enough for many people to assume it must be good and that mum or dad will like it, so they buy it. I receive Christmas or birthday presents like this every year even though I spend weeks beforehand telling people NOT to buy me albums by certain artists!

At most the casual buyers have heard 10 second snippets on a TV ad and this is not enough to distinguish between the various "crossover" candidates - Katherine, All Angels and Angelis. So they buy based on rack position, price or guesswork.

Angelis have had the best rack positions, followed by Katherine, with All Angels some way behind (about half the "visibility" of the other two and out a week later). There's probably been some very clever promo (or arm twisting) by S. Cowell too - how on earth did he persuade Woolworths to position Angelis at no. 1 in their pop chart two weeks ago? HOW

The fact that even Katherine Jenkins has been outsold by Angelis speaks volumes.

Cheers, Dave

[nicola]

I was just in Tescos and it had All Angels down at number 19 whilst Katherine and Angelis were in the top ten (Angelis were above Katherine by one spot).

Thank you for your explanation Dave. I would have thought people would have gone for quality but I am always naive regarding people's taste and choices (I'm really at that age where I think everyone should have my opinion and I don't understand when they don't... I'll grow out of it...) lol

I'm really sorry to say this, but Angelis annoy me. They are very similar to The Choir Boys last year who were quickly thrown together to make a quick buck around Christmas time. Main difference is the Choirboys were actually quite good (Aled Jones picked them, not Simon Cowell!) It seems immensely obvious to me that Angelis won't be making another album since they only have the Christmas buying public to buy them this year - they won't be remembered after that. I feel sorry for the members, they are so young and don't even realise they're being tools.

I watch X-Factor and all that, but I can't stand the way these big pop gurus throw 'artists' out there to make them some quick money and ignore talent. Having said that, there is worse than Simon Cowell. Pete Waterman, I think, is the worst culprit.

I'm really sorry for saying these things. Geez, I seem to be on the only one who says negative things. Gotta throw some balance into the works eh? (I hope.) ... I'm really conscious of this fact you know... it bothers me.

[mariannek]

nicola said:

I'm really sorry for saying these things. Geez, I seem to be on the only one who says negative things. Gotta throw some balance into the works eh? (I hope.) ... I'm really conscious of this fact you know... it bothers me.

Hi, Nicola
I read your posts with great interest, realising that I am nowhere near your expertise to critique artists and their work!!

I myself am a sworn Hayley fan, I just adore her and her music....to tell you the truth I cannot find a single thing
wrong with her singing, and I look forward to her career which I believe will outlast many topselling quickies, like Angelis and
even Il Divo to name just 2 as far as I'm concerned!!

My point is, that you are perfectly right to say negative things about certain artists and their mentors!!! Please, DON'T EVER FEEL BAD ABOUT making honest observations..... you certainly know what you are talking about!! i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gif:

Love Marianne

[gerrit]

Hi Nicola,

You are not the only one that's negative about Angelis. In fact, at one stage I put both Angelis and All Angels into the same category as The Choirboys - one-album wonders.

I have since come to the conclusion that a lot more care has gone into getting All Angels together than Angelis and that All Angels are superior.

Still, when such young people are put together, there is always the chance that the "chemistry" only lasts one album. I am still inclined to believe that in the case of both All Angels and Angelis there may have been too much of an emphasis on the individual members of the group. In both cases rhere is a risk of someone dropping out - and what will that do to the group? If you can believe the newspaper reports, both All Angels and Angelis came about after a selection process lasting a few years.

All Angels being "older", there's a much greater chance of stability. Besides, in the case of Angelis, they may have to look for replacements for the 3 boys quite soon, as their voices will break.

I am much more confident with a choir like Libera (which used to be called "Angel Voices" ....) as this boys choir has existed for a long time, and the emphasis is not centered on individual members, but on the choir as a whole - which has a changing membership, and where such changes are a natural process.

I am just wondering what other people feel about this - but maybe this warrants a separate thread?

Gerrit

[grant]

Hi Nicola

I'm with Marianne on this one! I read your posts with interest because you always seem to know what you are talking about!

I don't think 'technically' about music - if I like something I usually say so, if I don't, mostly I keep quiet

What really annoys me are those people who criticise something they know nothing about!!

As Marianne said, if you honestly believe something you should say so!!

Grant

[Richard]

Hello Nicola and Gerrit!

I'm very much in agreement with both of you regarding Angelis and All Angels, and I think Charlotte, Daisy, Laura and Melanie are a much better long-term prospect, both chart-wise and career-wise. All Angels may be a group but they are getting plenty of recognition as four individuals, and most people know and use their individual names. On the other hand, the only individual that springs to mind when I hear a mention of Angelis is SC. Need I go on?

Best Wishes,

Richard

[Dave]

Reposted from the AAI forum

Here are the early but official pop album chart positions today (updated with sales in brackets)

1 (NE) WESTLIFE (219,662)
2 (NE) OASIS (213,289)
3 (NE) BEATLES (173,517)
4 (NE) U2 (101,083)

10 (05) ANGELIS (39,463)
11 (06) KATHERINE JENKINS (38,043)

13 (NE) FRON MALE VOICE CHOIR (35,762)

19 (09) ALL ANGELS (26,857)

So the most boring new pop album gets the no. 1 and the most boring classical crossover album (Angelis) is (still) highest too. However, the top 4 achieved huge sales of the kind only normally seen in the US and in most other weeks, any of the 4 would have been top by a long way.

So, the hype wins and the music loses? Angelis are not counted as classical though I think the Fron Choir will be so the new Classical Artist chart (probably next week's Classic FM chart too) will be:

1. (01) Katherine
2. (NE) Fron
3. (02) All Angels.

Edit - I've just added exact sales figures for last week and as you can see, Fron beat All Angels' sales total from last week. And it looks like their album may be their debut album - even though they were formed nearly 60 years ago !

Therefore, if it is their debut album, they are now the all-time fastest-selling debut classical album, replacing all Angels.

However, if true, All Angels now have an unbeatable record - the shortest-lived all-time fastest-selling debut classical album (1 week!) so well done All Angels - you are now unbeatable!!!

Cheers, Dave

[postscript]

Hi Nicola.

A couple of additional observations. Following the announcement (Classic fm) that All Angels was No. 2, Waitrose perversely displaced All Angels from their original 4 to 8! Clearly Waitrose (owned by John Lewis) is not a store to be taken seriously regarding chart placings! And it was still at £11.99 and still only had thirteen and not fourteen tracks!

Regarding negativity, I think you raise an interesting point. Why are we here? I would suggest:

• to support the artiste, in this case Hayley
  
• in that support we find cause to interact between ourselves, getting to know ourselves and exchanging experiences with, about, of, the artiste, further enhancing interest in the forum
  
• the value of the forum is not just those who proactively interact but as a source of reliable information for the benefit of the 'day-tripper' who may make us a regular haunt and so further promote Hayley.
  
• the camaraderie of ourselves, hopefully, but especially the sharing of our experiences of Hayley help to further promote interest and appreciation of her
  
• to be all gush would arguably undermine our endeavours. No one is perfect and we devalue ourselves if we seem only to praise
  

The key, then, in criticism, or the expression of contrary views, is in the validity of their context.

If one has negative views, one should try to balance with reasons for being constructive, equally in context (which you do) but even so, your views are part of an overall 'balance' between all of us. In that, hopefully, we reflect a microcosm of the real world and therefore by that 'cut and thrust' between us, add further guidance for the artiste.

Arguably, it is the critical voice that is of more value to the artiste than is the fulsomeness of praise. Clearly, praise IN CONTEXT and therefore seemingly objective and rational, is of course a delight to receive and in fact there is an art (which Hayley has in abundance) in receiving praise gracefully.

But criticism, balanced and in context, is also of value. The artiste may say, 'someone else said that'. 'That's the third or fourth time someone's mentioned that, perhaps I ought to think it through a bit more. Or, equally, they may determine that that is not the route they wish to take and so dismiss it.,

The key, is that the debate helps the artiste by being reasoned and balanced, bringing further diversity.

In the same way, those of us able to see Hayley most regularly, always hang back to the last, risking that she runs out of time for us, because we know that what is of value to Hayley (and her enjoyment) is new faces and above all diversity of numbers from whom she can receive directly further input.

Of course, for the 'stalwarts' they provide a unique contribution. Seeing her from concert to concert, they are able to make valid comparisons, building an understanding of her circumstances from which they have a unique contribution to make.

Like so much in life, it is a matter `of balance, not so much a matter of what is right or wrong.

Hope I haven't simply duplicated similar responses to your post, Nicola. But time forces my immediate departure until later in the day to catch up on the last two or three days of posts.
Peter S.

[Jeff]

I was hoping All Angels would displace KJ from the No. 1 spot in the Classic FM chart. Instead they are down to No.3 because "Voices from the Valleys" has gone straight in at No.2. If Aled Jones new album enters the top 3 next week, we'll have an all Welsh Top 3 . Maybe we should call the Monopolies Commission ! i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gif

[Dave]

Hi Jeff,

Don't worry about Aled, he won't!

Katherine is in trouble too (from the Welsh boyos!).

All Angels will sit quietly there between and betwixt the Welsh, quietly awaiting their chance... for which we can but keep our fingers crossed.

Cheers, Dave

[nicola]

This may be worth mentioning - my brothers copy of the Sun on Saturday had a huge article on popera topping the charts for Christmas.

Its contenders were:
Angelis (which were favourites!)
G4
Il Divo

They did not mention All Angels, Fron, Aled Jones nor Katherine Jenkins. At first, I thought, well, maybe the others don't have a chance at all. But a closer look at this selection said something different to me.

These bands were relevant to put in the Sun because they all have something to do with the X-Factor, which is doing really well at the moment.

G4 - Runners-up of X-Factor; keep making appearences on Xtra factor this year; are managed by Louis Walsh

Il Divo - Appeared on X-Factor this year on a results show; managed by Simon Cowell

Angelis - Managed my Simon Cowell (and on the article, it said these kids were searched for for over two years... for some reason, this makes me angrier).

I don't think the Sun was giving an accurate description of what popera artists could get to number one at all.

My bet is on Il Divo though. I really don't like Il Divo myself (much prefer G4). That's if a classical album does reach number one.

I bet is the new Take That album, really.

[Dave]

Hi Nicola,

You are quite right, the article is typical tabloid rubbish which displays an almost complete ignorance of the music scene. The only one of their suggestions that has even a remote chance of topping the charts is Il Divo - Angelis have no chance and G4 seems to have flopped.

I think you are right, Take That will almost certainly be top of the album charts for Christmas Week but the X Factor winner (whoever it is!) will, of course, be top of the singles chart that week (as last year).

Fron Male Voice Choir or Katherine Jenkins look like topping the classical charts in Christmas week with All Angels as the outsiders. All Angels have a chance because of their forthcoming single release "Angels" but I have no idea whatsoever if it will get enough airplay to make a big impact. Singles by classical artists usually get almost zero airplay so why should the radio and TV music stations suddenly change their dinasaur ways now? TV and radio producers make me mad.

Cheers, Dave

[Jeff]

Well, well ! KJ knocked off the top of the chart by her fellow Welshmen ! They played "Abide with me" from the Fron choir album on Saturday. They've also recorded "Danny Boy". Hopefully that's a good omen for February !