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Post by roger on Dec 16, 2007 23:36:47 GMT
I went to five or six Hayley events in NYC and in each case I recognised or met people from Decca/Universal, including then-Decca-honcho Costa Pilavachi at one such gig. I also recall seeing evidence of Decca's support at numerous events, albeit in the UK. Costa Pilavachi, then the Chief Executive of Decca UK, was even standing amongst the crowds when Hayley did a signing session at HMV in september 2005. He was also very appreciative of HWI and was genuinely grateful for the support that we give to Hayley. The hope that Bedlam Management or Decca might care to clarify the situation is, I suspect, a little optimistic. However, the opportunity is there if they so wish as people from both are members of this forum. Roger
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Dec 17, 2007 2:23:50 GMT
Hello everyone, I'll start by referring to the new thread started by Jon about Josh Groban here but as I touch on much wider aspects than that, I've posted in this thread. Hayley is as big in NZ as Josh Groban is in the US. She normally charts higher/sells more in NZ and the UK than Josh does in those Countries but obviously, not in the US. She does have some success, albeit only in the Classical Crossover arena where she is 9th in the new Billboard annual chart - this is only 3 places behind Sarah Brightman. Josh's US smash-hit Noel has barely scraped the UK pop charts, staying outside the top 100 in its second week. Matters "music" are clearly far from straightforward - it's a truism I think that "there's no accounting for taste" and yes, Josh did do a promo visit to the UK six months ago for "Awake" but even then, it failed to reach the top ten and soon dropped down the chart again. I think Hayley has had her try (tries!) at breaking into the US mainstream album market and as things stand, I fear that she may not get another shot at it for some time. Most if not all the suggestions in this thread have I think already been tried by the US arm of Decca and their agents - and they are no fools. They are not going to risk their money (well Hayley's money!) again unless something unexpected and spectacular happens to make Hayley stand out and grab the headlines. Something like recording the soundtrack vocals for a blockbuster movie might do it, it's hard to see what else would make them try again as hard as they have done in the past. But I think Hayley will continue to sell useful numbers of albums in the US, assuming little or no promotion perhaps around 30,000 a year in total (all albums) and she is likely to have a continuing presence in the classical crossover chart but not the main chart. Add to that perhaps 50,000 a year in NZ, 100,000 in the UK (potentially 200,000 I think) and maybe 30,000 a year in Japan and you can see where her main markets are. Of course, Hayley sells smaller numbers of albums in many other Countries around the globe (HK, Singapore, Taiwan, Canada, Australia etc.,) which when added together make a useful addition to the totals but obviously, the promotional activity and spend is going to be concentrated in the main markets. Of the four main markets, I think the obvious place for Hayley to spend most of her time is the UK simply because that's where she sells most albums... followed by NZ (where at last she is now spending more time) then Japan, which does well because the average price of CDs is higher there than in the UK and US, so each album she sells there will be worth more than elsewhere. It does not at the moment seem to make much sense for Hayley to spend long periods of time in the US because it doesn't seem to be cost-effective (in spite of all the efforts made there in the past, Pure 2004 then Il Divo, Celtic Woman and some of her own tours). The weakness of the dollar exchange rate compared to the other three must also be a factor so I suspect that unless another "Celtic Woman" type of tour comes up, Hayley will not be doing as much in the US as in recent years but i suspect (and hope) that there will be some US concerts and promotion. At the end of the day, Hayley now owns a home in a no doubt expensive part of London and she will be inclined to take fewer risks now I think, to ensure that she can keep it! It must be a difficult balancing act. Hayley knows what happens when she is out of the UK or NZ around the time of new album releases - her album sales drop significantly. This was shown dramatically when Hayley had to leave the UK prematurely for Celtic Woman, the week after Treasure was released - it dropped rapidly down the charts after en excellent initial top 10 entry. In NZ, the initial release soon came off the no. 1 spot but shot back up there again as soon as Hayley arrived to promote it in person. If she wants to maximise her album sales, she needs to be present in her most profitable markets for as long as possible before and after the release dates - which needs careful scheduling and that went wrong this year - it needs to be got right in 2008. I wonder if the days of taking risks in the hope of "making it" in the US may be over for Hayley - it's well known in the UK Music Industry that unless you are lucky enough to get it exactly right first time - which is hard - it can be like pouring money into a black hole. But I am certain of this: Hayley, her Management and record company will continue to look for opportunities to undertake one-off concerts or anything else that comes up in the US - you never know what might develop from them - the potential rewards are huge but that does not justify risk taking and jeopardising her other main markets unless there is clear evidence that something will happen next time that didn't happen at the time of Il Divo or Celtic Woman. But I can't see any such evidence at the moment. Cheers, Dave
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Joe
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Post by Joe on Dec 17, 2007 2:51:38 GMT
Hello Dave, Thanks for your words, I think After all, everything revolves around money. I shall leave it at that. Joe
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Dec 17, 2007 3:09:59 GMT
Hi Joe, Don't worry, what do I know? One thing is sure, I hope there will be another big effort in the US at some point, I just think it's more likely that we will get occasional attempts to chip away at the market and that means, of course, occasional concerts or appearances too. I am sure Hayley herself wants to do more over there but probably needs to stabilise her other main markets first, where she knows she can make a living from the combination of album sales, concerts and other things (the Japanese Boysenberry ad, Jekyll, Flood etc.). These may have suffered at the time of Il Divo and Celtic Woman. Once she has some margin to spare, she can risk another "attack" on the US market, I'm just not sure how, at the moment but things can develop out of nowhere. Cheers, Dave
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Post by milewalker on Dec 17, 2007 3:34:24 GMT
As you might infer from a previous post of mine above, Dave, I am not surprised by your analysis - in fact, this has been a closet fear of mine since Steven posted that little aside regarding Hayley's appearance at Ulysses. Frankly, I hope I am reading too much into that However, I agree with most of your analysis subject to one rather harsh observation and a quibble. I suspect that she would sell 30,000 in NZ with no promotion at all. I can understand the sentimental reasons she might want to spend time there, and also the desire to spend time with her family. But if NZ promotion only makes a difference of 20K in sales, wouldnt the bulk of the time be better spent elsewhere - like the UK where it might contribute to closing the gap between 100K and 200K sales? The quibble is that I am not sure how relevant the comparison with Brightman is for two reasons. First, I dont think Sarah has released a CD of new material since Harem - and that was 4 years ago. I suspect that this might artificially depress her presence on the classical crossover chart in 2007. Second, she has (or at least had as of two or three years ago enough name recognition to enable her to do a quite extensive tour. Brightman has played a venue in St Louis Mo twice since 2000. Jon PS - I will add a personal observation, and then I think leave this topic alone for a while unless someone has something else to contribute. This topic is near and dear to me for a very simple reason. During the pledge part of her PBS concert back in 2004, there was a tour announced - which included a stop at Powell Symphony Hall in St Louis. Of course, I pledged the maximum, and got two tickets......When that tour was cancelled, the PBS station offered me alternative merchandise of course, but.... .
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Post by fusilier23 on Dec 17, 2007 4:33:42 GMT
About what I expected, and Dave is largely right, at least on the conventional level, though he's also right that things can change quickly. We'll just have to see what '08 brings.
I hate it when PBS offers alternative merchandise for failed tours or other botched events, since that happened to me as well. If you fail, you should offer a refund and try again, not tap a closet of unused merchandise.
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Post by howard on Dec 17, 2007 23:44:45 GMT
Hello All,
I agree to what Jon proposed that we leave this subject to rest for awhile. And I noticed before I brought this subject up again on Dec 2007, The last time this subject was mentioned was March 2007 by Jon...
And Dave I totally agree that Hayley concentrates on the Uk only...
A voice like Hayleys' will be heard....
God Bless Hayley and I wish her the greatest success!!!!!!!!!!!
Best Wishes to All, Howard
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Post by Richard on May 11, 2008 9:30:53 GMT
This post has been moved from the Classical Brit Awards 2008 thread. I don't think Hayley has IGNORED her US fans, Mounting a tour of the US would cost a fortune and maybe to no avail. Prepare a nice polite email and send it to as many radio stations as you can think of requesting Hayley's music for whomever ! I don't think Hayley herself is ignoring her US fans, but perhaps Bedlam is, and Decca is also quite discriminatory by deciding for us what songs we would and wouldn't like, forcing us to buy at least 2 of each album in order to hear all the songs.
I don't think a tour would be "to no avail". If she would tour with someone else more famous here, as she did with Il Divo & CW, it would be okay. I would rather see only Hayley, but I do realize that wouldn't work very well yet.
I e-mailed my local Christian station sometime last year and requested that they play "Abide with Me", but of course they never did. Most of their playlist is more contemporary than hymns, or just weird contemporary versions of hymns. Maybe when her next album comes out, I'll try more stations. It's probably even less likely now that any of them would play Treasure songs, but maybe I'll try anyway, and suggest "Summer Rain" to the station that plays Josh Groban (occasionally).
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Post by Libby on May 12, 2008 2:46:28 GMT
One thing that could help Hayley's popularity would be to star in a play. Someone said that Sarah Brightman became famous by starring in Andrew Lloyd Webber's plays. Hayley has lots of experience on the stage, so that seems like a good possibility to me. Even Josh Groban is starring in a play in London this week.
Speaking of Josh Groban, if Hayley would collaborate with him, that would certainly help. Josh's many devoted fans would all hear it, and I'm sure a large number of them would become interested in Hayley's music because of it. I think it would be even better if they wrote a song together. They have both proven themselves to be excellent songwriters, so I think it'd be wonderful if they'd write one together.
Another thing that would help would be for her to sing on a soundtrack of a movie that's widely seen in the U.S. The Hobbit would be good, because it would likely be a big success just as TLOTR was, and the fact that she is from New Zealand, where it will be fimed. Of course, there was that "Love and Virtue" movie, but apparently that won't be happening anytime soon. A lot more people would be interested in the soundtrack of a LOTR movie than one about some king from hundreds of years ago. I personally have no interest in such a movie at all (apart from it's relation to Hayley). I find them quite dreary. And "The Hobbit" will be anything but!
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Post by sonata58 on May 12, 2008 16:02:37 GMT
Josh Groban was at the Classical Brit Awards. Hopefully, he watched Hayley's performance. Maybe he'll think of inviting her to do a duet with him. I'm not a Josh Groban fan, but he seems to be very big here in the US.
I think that Hayley should ride off the success of Celtic Woman. Maybe she should launch another US tour promoted as "Former Honorary Celtic Woman Member"?
My local metroplex has a classical all-request show every Sunday. What songs off Hayley's US releases would you recommend I request for an American audience?
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Joe
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Post by Joe on May 13, 2008 0:37:06 GMT
As posted by Larry: For the one who asked what Hayley should sing in the U S, Sorry I couldn't come up with your name ; but I couldn't find the post again. I would like O Mio Babbino Caro, Lascia ch'io pianga, Shubert's Ave Maria, Bachianas Brasilerias No. 5, Santa Lucia, and of course Pokakekara Ana. It really doesn't matter they'll fall in love with her and her angelic voice. If you get her there I'll be there too.
Good Luck Larry .
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Post by sonata58 on May 13, 2008 14:17:07 GMT
For the one who asked what Hayley should sing in the U S, Sorry I couldn't come up with your name ; but I couldn't find the post again. I would like O Mio Babbino Caro, Lascia ch'io pianga, Shubert's Ave Maria, Bachianas Brasilerias No. 5, Santa Lucia, and of course Pokarekare Ana .Unfortunately, nearly none of them are available on Hayley's US releases (and those happen to be the ones I prefer too). I did a little internet research to see which of Hayley's "classical" songs are most popular. I sent in a request listing: Dark Waltz, May it Be, and Shenandoah. I'll let you all know which/if any were played. Believe if or not, according to the Zune Marketplace, Hayley's most played song is I Say Grace.
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Post by roger on May 13, 2008 14:47:24 GMT
Hi sonata58 Believe if or not, according to the Zune Marketplace, Hayley's most played song is I Say Grace. Strange that you should say that because 'I Say Grace' doesn't appear on either of the UK versions. Roger
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Post by stevemacdonald on May 13, 2008 15:11:47 GMT
Hi sonata58 Believe if or not, according to the Zune Marketplace, Hayley's most played song is I Say Grace. Strange that you should say that because 'I Say Grace' doesn't appear on either of the UK versions. Roger If I'm not mistaken, outfits like Zune & iTunes make it possible to get this song no matter where one lives. That could explain the success of "I Say Grace", in that folks in the UK are snapping it up this way.
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Post by Umbobo on May 13, 2008 18:57:09 GMT
Yeah if you have iTunes you can change countires to buy the UK tracks from Hayley and vise-versa
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