Overly Obsessive

[roger]

Hi Jon,

I don't see anybody here as being obsessed with Hayley. I see us as a group of loyal supporters who enjoy discussing any part of her public persona. Yes, many of us do stand up for her if the need arises - that is all part of the support which we like to give.

As I have said before, I believe HWI's role is to help promote and support Hayley and to protect her if necessary. The only way we are likely to be able to do that last part is by exercising some level of control over what is said on this forum. That said, we also believe in freedom of speech and so a reasonable balance must be found at all times. We endeavour to do just that.

Roger

[jons]

Hi Roger,

I understand the concern with deep talk about Hayley's appearance. I wouldn't care if she just wore a bin bag for instance, but I do not like those people who say nasty things about Hayley. I'm hoping they are not that widespread, but It makes me angry if someone agrees with them and tries to make excuses for them. I'm sorry about the thread I started, but I don't think people should get away with that and I mean it when I say the criticism of a good person ends here. All I won't to do now is enjoy Hayley's music and talk about the amazing things she does. But its starts me off if someone has go. The thread I posted was just me having a go at that guy and trying to prove a point, I just was hoping for some positive responses and that would of been that.

[petertong]

I really think its only an obsession when it detracts/misdirects you from the life you are supposed to be living (developing your own gifts, growing as a person, growing in relationship with others etc), and becomes a curse/poison to your soul.

As long as the above is not happening and we are respecting our favourite artist properly then why not be free to have some fun celebrating great performances with her, and have some fun with each other while we are doing that? Thats how I see it

Peter

PS: Hayley's music for me is an "addition" which has added much enjoyment (like many other things I've discovered) for me and my friends I've got other "additions" too which I don't talk about on this board... I like stuffing superchargers on a certain type of early brand of car for example Balance, balance, and balance!

PPS: As far as nasty things being said about Hayley... so what! Any time you put yourself out there that will happen. I don't think its a big deal...goes with the territory. Sometimes I even think that opposition like that is used for the good. So no worries - HW seems to be a rather mature person for her age and can deal with it

PPPS: I just wanted to add that half the time (90%? whats written in the media is just absolute poppycocks? (as my Scottish HS teacher used to say).

[grant]

petertong said:

I really think its only an obsession when it detracts/misdirects you from the life you are supposed to be living (developing your own gifts, growing as a person, growing in relationship with others etc), and becomes a curse/poison to your soul.

I think that's very true Peter. To be really obsessive is very destructive because it is doing exactly what you refer to above.

Certainly when I'm near Hayley, especially when there are other HWI members there, we are generally more reserved than most because we know what to expect and wait patiently for 'our' time with her.

As for the hate thing. Well, I guess it's born out of jealousy or just to be different and we should ignore it. Not easy though when it's aimed at someone we care deeply about and we certainly wouldn't tollerate it if it were aimed at someone in one of our families.

I'll shut up now!

Best wishes
Grant

[mariannek]

Hi Natasha,
I know you appreciate feedback on your post on *obsession* with Hayley and I hope you won't mind another comment this time from me.
I am deeply thankful that Hayley has become part of my life. She is a truly admirable person and artist. I am deeply thankful for the gift of her unique voice, for her keenness to give her best every time she performs, her keenness to grow as an artist, her wonderful kindness in acknowledging all her fans personally whenever she can, for the love she has for her family, her friends, her fans and her God.
I am personally in awe of her innocence and wholesomeness. She is not perfect, but neither is any one of us.
Loving Hayley is not an obsession with me, but a continued interest in her development as a singer and as a person. I am deeply thankful for the pleasure and the happiness she gives to me when I listen to her music.
Love, Marianne

[roger]

fusilier23 said:

...a big chunk of the fanbase here is composed of two groups: 1) young wannabe singers who see the performer not only as what they can become vocally, but as the epitome of coolness that may be lacking in their own lives,

I am aware that some of our members are leaning towards that category and what a wonderful role model they have chosen. Good luck to them all.

fusilier23 said:

and 2) unmarried adults whose better days are largely behind them.

I am equally aware that there are people in this world who fall into that category but I have never seen any evidence of it being remotely true of any of our members. Furthermore, I find the suggestion somewhat offensive.

Thankfully, there is a third category which is the reason why most, perhaps all, of us are here. We happen to love Hayley's voice and everything for which she stands. We wish to promote her name and discuss her career with like-minded people.

Roger

[Steve H]

Hi All,

I think this thread is now getting too deep and a little too personal, though still on topic I think we should just reflect on where the thread is going, and whether it really needs to be said on this forum.

Remember that Hayley and her family read it too.

Steve H

[fusilier23]

(sigh) Be offended, then. My concern is that's the PERCEPTION, and as you know, perception sometimes trumps the truth.

[roger]

Yes, I will. And I am already hearing that I am not the only one. What you have implied is outrageous, without foundation and wholly unacceptable.

I would respectfully request that you refrain from further posts to this thread on the grounds that you risk damaging HWI's good reputation and the friendly environment that so many of us have strived for years to maintain.

Roger

[milewalker]

Heh

Hayley is now a 20 year old woman - I dont think there is anything unreasonable being stated on this thread.

Frankly, I have seen very little here which I would even remotely call "obsessive". One thing I do see from time to time is what might be called "fan projection" - which is nothing more than the very human and normal attempt to project our own hopes and fears onto our subject.

What is normally the case - and I dont think that either Hayley or her fans are an exception - is that there is a blank space at the center which is the real Hayley. None of us really "know" her in the sense that we would know a friend, even if we have met her 412 times after concerts At best, we see one aspect of her, under circumstances which she controls. The fact that she is so willing to please under those controlled circumstances probably does say something about her personality - but I would be hesitant to take that too far because I suspect no one has seen her without that public face on.

Because there is that blank space in the middle, it is a very human thing to filter what we do see, by way of her public personality, her music, the kinds of songs she sings, her interviews, and anything else which interfaces Hayley with us. We then use that filtered information to try to fill in the blank space. This is why some people who are devoutly Christian see an appearance like at the Crystal Cathedral one way, and others see it differently. All of us filter the information we receive according to our own experiences, and then project that onto the blank space.

Even at age 20, something about Hayley seems to almost universally strike us as both innocent and vulnerable - hence the need some of us feel to "protect" her. I will freely admit it irritates me sometimes - but that in the end is nothing more than my own projection. It is how I would have felt at age 20 were this happening to me.

All of this is more than half an illusion of course, but an inevitable one. We have the human need to like the person we spend our time and money on. In the vast majority of cases it is also perfectly normal, and completely harmless.

Jon

[fusilier23]

As you wish. It is not my intention to damage anything, only to ask some questions. I see I have gone about asking them the wrong way.

[roger]

Okay, thank you. For what it is worth, I can assure you you have no cause to be concerned about the members of this forum and no need to ask questions. Should anything untoward be said, we have a dependable team of moderators who will deal with it.

I have seen many of our members at Hayley's concerts and none of them have ever treated her with anything other than the utmost respect.

Let's move on.
Roger

[Dave]

fusilier23 said:

...It is not my intention to damage anything, only to ask some questions. I see I have gone about asking them the wrong way.

Yes indeed Steven, you have. And your analysis (over-analysis, I think) looks flawed to me. For example, I know that some of us on here have so many demands on our time that it's hard to find any spare time to keep up with "all things Hayley" as it is, never mind needing to fill some hypothetical void.

It seems to me that this thread has been interesting but already, within 24 hours, it is I feel close to running its course.

Cheers, Dave

[Joe]

fusilier23 said:

So I think everyone here needs to ask himself/herself the question "why am I here on this site?" Check your motivation. If it's something unhealthy, for God's sake don't keep feeding it, and if you think you need help, by all means get it.

OK, why am I here? You left out three words in your post...I SUPPORT HAYLEY.

Young wannabe singers...I know of two or three who are hugely important here...I hope it's not them.

I fall into the third category which you convieniently didn't mention.

Hayley is in the public image...talking about her hair of color of her dress is normal in any discussion. I woudn't want any fan of mine waiting for a performer to emerge from an unmarked back door. That's when it becomes an obsession.

I think that no more can be said about this topic. Tashi, if anything you find on the forum that you find uncomforable, you let me know.

I'm going to lock this thread in three hours.

[graemek]

Well, That took a bit of plowing thru.

Milewalker, I like what you said in your last post.

It's the first time I'm aware of the word limerence in my 65 years altho I have been in love in my young days (the despairing category)

"Limerence, as posited by psychologist Dorothy Tennov, is an involuntary cognitive and emotional state in which a person feels an intense romantic desire for another person (the limerent object). Limerence can often be what is meant when one expresses "having a crush" on someone else although limerence, unlike a crush, can last months, years or even a lifetime. It is characterized by intrusive thinking and pronounced sensitivity to external events that reflect the disposition of the limerent object towards the individual. It can be experienced as intense joy or as extreme despair, depending on whether or not the feelings are reciprocated. While the use of the word has not gained widespread acceptance, nor can it be found in most current dictionaries, limerence theory is nevertheless used in psychological studies dealing with romantic love and is frequently discussed by those interested in Tennov's work.

Tennov describes limerence as beginning with a barely perceptible feeling of increased interest in the limerent object, that, if nurtured by appropriate conditions, can grow to enormous intensity, although in most cases it subsides to a low level after some time. At this stage, states Tennov, limerence is either transformed through reciprocation or it is transferred to another person who then becomes the new limerent object. Under the best of conditions the waning of limerence through mutuality is accompanied by the growth of an emotional response more suitably described as love."

If I'd known this 40 years ago odd, I might have been able to talk myself of it .
I still remember her with great fondness & no bitterness but my ultimate solution has been to meet & marry Marianne (limerant object) whom I have limerence for dearly. That was 37 years ago. i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gif

warmest regards Graeme i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gif

PS I learn a great deal from this forum. We're all so very different.