Dave
Administrator
HWI Admin
Posts: 7,689
|
Post by Dave on Jun 24, 2004 2:01:55 GMT
Estimate of Hayley's Worldwide CD salesEstimating Hayley's worldwide sales is VERY tricky because Decca have been keeping the sales figures close to their chest. Usually, they issue a press release only if a "record" is broken. For example, when Hayley passed Charlotte Church's UK record for the highest selling debut classical album [EDIT - I do not think Decca are now claiming this record - I assume they "jumped the gun"] last December, they said Pure had sold 700,000 copies in the UK (Press release published December 26 but they didn't specify what date it was up to and I have assumed Sunday December 21st). The other problem is that "awards" such as platinum discs are based on CDs shipped to shops and stores and not over-the-counter sales. So, unsold CDs stuck on shop shelves are counted when awards are given - but you can't include them in the actual sales figures. A platinum album in Oz, for example, is 70,000 shipments but actual sales may be somewhat less than this when the award is given. However, it is possible to roughly estimate weekly sales based on chart position in the major CD markets such as the US and the UK. In the case of the UK, I also have a fairly good estimate of the 2004 sales upto a few weeks ago - they were almost identical to the first week sales of an album released by D12. And when Hayley is in the US top 200, I can usually obtain actual sales figures. Similarly, when Pure is in the Japan top 300, I can get actual sales figures. All I have for Australia is the fact that Pure went Platinum (70,000 shipments) early this year. By now, sales are probably a bit above that figure (but less than 140,000) so I have assumed 90,000. It *may* be higher but it's been out of their charts for a long time, so not by much. In NZ, it's a bit easier than Oz - Pure recently went 11X platinum there (165,000 shipments) and I have assumed 157,000 actual sales. For Hong Kong, Singapore and Taiwan, I have nothing other than what Decca and Billboard have said - Billboard most recently and they mentioned a figure of 30,000 for all three, a few months ago. Decca have issued a few statements about the worldwide sales of Pure and the highest I have seen is 1.2 million, with an unsubstantiated press report mentioning 1.3 million. The comment on CBBC in the UK a few months ago (1.5 million) is also unsubstantiated and probably refers to Hayley's sales of ALL CDs worldwide, not just for Pure. So, if anyone sees ANY official statements regarding sales of any of Hayley's CDs, or thinks any of the figures are wrong, please post in this thread (with links if possible) - and I will update the totals.OK, here are my estimates: Pure: UK 803,000 NZ 157,000 Japan 93,000 Oz 90,000 US 62,000 HK/S/TW 30,000 PURE: 1,235,000 ' Other CDs: AG(JP) 110,000 HW(NZ) 55,000 MGTY(NZ) 25,000 ' TOTAL 1,425,000
[/SIZE] This matches very closely the recent statement on the Joe's Pub website that "this 17-year-old singing sensation has sold nearly a million and a half CDs worldwide while breaking chart records and winning over audiences around the globe". So, for the moment, it's nearly 1.3 million for Pure and nearly 1.5 million for all Hayley's CD sales
|
|
Dave
Administrator
HWI Admin
Posts: 7,689
|
Post by Dave on Aug 5, 2004 0:25:32 GMT
I won't do a full update on sales this time as there won't have been any significant changes since June apart from in the US. Thanks to chartsman "Hanboo" on another forum, I've been able to estimate the total US sales, from a combination of official and estimated "Soundscan" sales. These are (using Billboard publication dates): 05Jun 52,080 (official total to date) 12Jun to 24Jul 21,000 (estimate assuming 3,000 pw for 7 weeks while out of Billboard 200) 31Jul 4,000 (semi-official estimate) 07Aug 8,380 (official total for last week) Total 85,460
[/size] So, as some of the figures are (conservative) estimates, let's say 85,000 upto last week and probably over 90,000, when this week's chart comes out tomorrow.
|
|
Dave
Administrator
HWI Admin
Posts: 7,689
|
Post by Dave on Aug 7, 2004 16:33:52 GMT
US Classical Charts and Sales information
There is an excellent in-depth (and positive) article today, about the current state of the Classical and Classical Crossover markets in the US. The article is here at wcnc.com[/b][/url] but you will need to register (free) to read it, or it may appear on HWI soon. It's especially nice to see Hayley mentioned several times in the same breath as Josh Groban and Yo-Yo Ma as one of the top three "Classical" artists in the US. Slowly but surely, the word is spreading! Some interesting sales figures are quoted from Billboard: 3,500 to 7,000 sales in a week normally gets you to the top of the Classical Crossover chart (average 4,500) and sometimes, into the Billboard 200, too. Hayley has surpassed 7,000 sales in a week several times this year (8,380 in last week's chart) but unfortunately, she still cannot get above 2nd place. This is because of Josh Groban, who seems to have re-written the crossover chart rules single-handedly since last year. He has been selling 25,000 to 100,000 a week this year and, to date, his CD "Closer" has sold 3.7 million copies. That's some target for Hayley to aim for! However, in normal times (before Groban!), Pure would have been the top Classical Crossover album in the US for most of the last 4 months and I can use this information to estimate its sales in weeks when it's out of the Billboard 200 and official figures are not available. As mentioned above in this thread, the total US sales of "Pure", to date, are now at least 90,000.[/size] [/color]
|
|
Dave
Administrator
HWI Admin
Posts: 7,689
|
Post by Dave on Dec 16, 2004 18:00:41 GMT
Estimate of Hayley's Worldwide CD salesEstimating Hayley's worldwide sales is VERY tricky because Decca have been keeping the sales figures close to their chest. Usually, they issue a press release only if a "record" is broken.... UPDATED SALES ESTIMATES mid Dec 2004 Pure: UK 700,000 (800,000+ shipped to stores?) NZ 160,000 US 150,000 (400,000+ shipped to stores?) Japan 100,000+ Oz 90,000+ Germany 80,000? HK/S/TW 30,000 Canada 15,000 Ireland 7,000? Others 10,000+(?) PURE: 1,342,000+ (2 million shipped to stores) ' Other CDs: AG(JP) 120,000 HW(NZ) 55,000 MGTY(NZ) 25,000 ' TOTAL 1,532,000 [/SIZE]These are reasonably conservative guesstimates so it could be a bit more, especially where + is shown. All we can really say is: "nearly 1.5 million" over-the-counter sales for Pure; and "over 1.5 million" for all Hayley's CDs. This is fairly consistent with Decca's recent announcement of "2 million worldwide sales" (they meant shipments!) at a time when many shops would have ordered large pre-Christmas stocks, as yet unsold. The big unknown is how many copies of "Pure" have been sent out to other Countries not listed above... it could be a lot more than 10K.The UK estimate has gone down, this is because I discovered Decca's "sales" announcements are usually for bulk "shipments" to shops & stores. Many of these are sitting unsold on the shelves at any given time - especially in November/December each year. The UK Special Edition looks like selling 35K to 40K across-the-counter by Christmas, to add to sales of just under 700K for the original release which now seems to have been deleted (but it's still selling, slowly). A triple platinum for Pure is still a possibility - or, if the SE is kept separate, another Silver or Gold disc. Quick Charts update (more tomorrow): Pure SE has re-entered the UK top 200 album chart at 84 and next week, it looks like it will climb to between 50 and 60. Unfortunately, it has once again failed to enter the US Billboard top 200 in the new US chart, out today.[/color]
|
|
Dave
Administrator
HWI Admin
Posts: 7,689
|
Post by Dave on Jan 6, 2005 1:39:19 GMT
Estimate of Hayley's Worldwide CD salesEstimating Hayley's worldwide sales is VERY tricky because Decca have been keeping the sales figures close to their chest. Usually, they issue a press release only if a "record" is broken.... UPDATED SALES ESTIMATES - end of year 2004 ' Pure: ' UK (orig)687,000 (720,000 shipped to stores) UK (SE) 50,000 (90,000 shipped) NZ 160,000 (175,000 shipped) US 200,000 (450,000 shipped) Japan 110,000 (150,000 shipped) Oz 100,000 ?(130,000 shipped) Germany 80,000 ? (90,000 shipped) HK/S/TW 30,000 (40,000 shipped) Canada 15,000 (25,000 shipped) Ireland 7,000 ? (10,000 shipped) Others 70,000 ?(120,000 shipped)?
PURE: 1,509,000+ (2 million shipped to stores) ' Other CDs: AG(JP) 120,000 HW(NZ) 55,000 MGTY(NZ) 25,000 ' TOTAL 1,709,000 [/SIZE]The actual sales (across the counter) are reasonably accurate guesstimates for the UK, US, NZ and Japan. The others are ball-park figures and I have increased most of the "shipments" to try and match Decca's recent claim of 2 million worldwide sales (meaning shipments) of Pure. Both figures for "Others" are complete guesses to reach the 2 million figure for shipments. We can probably now say fairly confidently "about 1.5 million across-the-counter sales" for Pure; and "over 2 million shipped (delivered to stores)" worldwide. The big unknown is how many copies of Pure have been sent out to "Other" Countries not listed above. [/color]
|
|
Dave
Administrator
HWI Admin
Posts: 7,689
|
Post by Dave on Jan 7, 2005 21:57:31 GMT
Sales Information for the Year 2004
Hayley achieved the best actual CD sales for the year 2004 in the US, followed by the UK.
1) US - "Pure" was 6th in the annual Classical Crossover chart (to November) - and had roughly 200,000 genuine sales to the end of the year. The artist albums above "Pure" were by: Josh Groban (two), Amici Forever, Yo-Yo Ma and Sarah Brightman.
Pure was not in the Billboard 200 chart for the year.
2) UK - "Pure" was the 3rd best selling classical "Artist" album of 2004 - joint 2nd if the sales of Pure Special Edition are added to the original. The actual sales in 2004 were: 101,000 for the original version and about 50,000 for the Special Edition, making approximately 151,000 in total for the year. This is identical to the total sales of Aled Jones' "Christmas Album" (a Gold album for over 100,000 shipments). The only classical artist to clearly exceed the sales of "Pure" was Katherine Jenkins with "Second Nature" at 246,000 actual sales for the year (a Platinum album for over 300,000 shipments).
None of these albums came anywhere near the actual sales achieved by "Pure" in 2003 in the UK - 579,000 (Double Platinum album for over 600,000 shipments). As I mentioned in the charts thread today, the total sales of "Pure" in the UK (both editions) have now reached approximately 730,000.
In the UK top 200 pop album chart for the year, the top classical album was by Katherine Jenkins at no. 71 (compared to no. 24 for Pure in 2003); Aled Jones was at no. 115; Pure (original) was at no. 186 but obviously, would have been around 115 if all sales of Pure were combined. No other classical albums were in the chart for 2004.
3) Germany I have no actual sales information from Germany but as Pure does not seem to have achieved a "Gold" award so far, the sales must be considerably less than the 100,000 (shipments) needed for that award. Based on chart positions, they are probably nearer 50,000 than 80,000.
4) Japan "Pure" sold about 50,000 in Japan for 2004 - mostly in the first 6 months of the year.
5) NZ In NZ, the apparently points (not sales) based chart for 2004 placed Pure at no. 7. I have no actual sales information but it would probably have been less than 30,000 in 2004, based on the increase in Platinum awards from 9x to 11x during the year.
|
|
Dave
Administrator
HWI Admin
Posts: 7,689
|
Post by Dave on Feb 11, 2005 18:02:57 GMT
NZ: 12 X platinum!In case anyone missed it, Hayley's official site said recently (in the Japan single announcement) that "Pure" has gone 12X platinum in NZ - even though it's currently out of the charts there. Pure now has a clear lead over the no. 2 all-time album by a local artist, Bic Runga's "Beautiful Collision" at 10X platinum. Hayley's album is now right in among the top echelon of all-time *International* sales in NZ, equalling the "Beatles 1" and "Abba Gold" awards of 12x platinum and beating Norah Jones "Come away with Me" at 11x platinum.Hayley still has some way to go to equal the top three all-time NZ albums by International artists, which have at least 17x platinum: 1) Abba "Best of ", 2) Dire Straits "Brothers in Arms" and 3) Shania Twain "Come on Over". She still has plenty of time to get there however... each time she releases a new album there will be a little boost for "Pure", so who knows?
|
|
Dave
Administrator
HWI Admin
Posts: 7,689
|
Post by Dave on Apr 13, 2005 19:30:47 GMT
UPDATED SALES ESTIMATES - end of year 2004 ' PURE: 1,509,000+ (2 million shipped to stores) Other CDs: AG(JP) 120,000 HW(NZ) 55,000 MGTY(NZ) 25,000 ' TOTAL 1,709,000
UPDATED SALES ESTIMATES - end of March 2005 ' Pure: [ * changed from last time] ' UK (orig)688,000 (720,000 shipped to stores)* UK (SE) 58,000 (90,000 shipped) * ' UK TOTAL 746,000 (810,000 shipped) * US 220,000 (350,000 shipped) * NZ 170,000 (180,000 shipped) * Japan 110,000 (150,000 shipped) Oz 100,000 ?(130,000 shipped) Germany 80,000 ? (90,000 shipped) HK/S/TW 30,000 (40,000 shipped) Canada 15,000 (25,000 shipped) Ireland 7,000 ? (10,000 shipped) Others 70,000 ?(120,000 shipped) [incl Swed, Port, SA]
PURE: 1,548,000+ (1.9 million shipped to stores) * ' Other CDs: AG(JP) 120,000 Wieg(JP) 4,000 * HW(NZ) 55,000 MGTY(NZ) 25,000 ' TOTAL 1,752,000 * [/SIZE]The actual sales (across the counter) are reasonably accurate guesstimates for the UK, US, NZ and Japan although the longer Pure is out of the main US album chart, the less accurate the estimate it is becoming. The others are ball-park figures and I have increased some of the "shipments" more than I'd like, to try and reach Decca's worldwide total claims. It was nice to see this week's NZ Stuff article quote "over 800,000 sales in the UK" for Pure (they mean shipments) as it closely matches my own previous estimate of 810,000 shipments. The latest worldwide shipments figure I've heard is 1.9 million for "Pure, announced by the Classic FM presenter at ClassicAlive last month in London. This is down a bit on their previous estimate - which I always thought was too high. The reduction is probably due to "sale or return" albums being returned to Decca after Christmas. It has allowed me to reduce the US shipments estimate to a more realistic 350K. Oh, Hayley's official site said in their 3rd Feb 2005 Press Release about Lorelei, that Pure has reached 12X platinum in NZ so I've increased the figures there accordingly. The figure for "Others" is a guess, to enable the total to reach the 1.9 million (shipments) that Decca currently seem to be claiming. We can now say fairly confidently that Worldwide, Hayley has sold: "over 1.5 million copies of Pure, in shops"; and "about 2 million to the trade" (shipments); and "1.75 million of her CDs in shops" A few miscellaneous facts & figures: Pure is not far off becoming the UK's biggest selling debut album by a classical artist, this would probably occur after her new CD is released, as that should pull Pure back into the charts for a while. It currently holds the UK record for the fastest selling album by a classical artist (19,420 in its first week on sale) and the only UK classical record Hayley cannot currently beat is that held by... The Three Tenors - the biggest of them all i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gifMy estimate of the most sales ever achieved in a week by "Pure" anywhere, is 85,000 - in the UK in the week before Christmas 2003. In two weeks, Hayley sold about 145,000 (from about no. 10 in the pop chart). [/color].
|
|
|
Post by roger on Apr 14, 2005 11:52:48 GMT
UPDATED SALES ESTIMATES - end of March 2005 PURE: 1,548,000+ [/b] (1.9 million shipped to stores) [/quote] Many thanks for the updated information, Dave. I find them quite fascinating! These figures would suggest that approximately 352,000 are currently being stocked at stores throughout the world yet I haven't seen any outside London for ages. So where are they all, I wonder? Roger
|
|
Dave
Administrator
HWI Admin
Posts: 7,689
|
Post by Dave on Apr 14, 2005 17:37:10 GMT
Many thanks for the updated information, Dave. I find them quite fascinating! These figures would suggest that approximately 352,000 are currently being stocked at stores throughout the world yet I haven't seen any outside London for ages. So where are they all, I wonder? Roger Hi Roger, if only I knew! 20%+ difference does seem a lot, I have to admit, but see below for an example of it. Specialists like HMV still stock Pure, don't they? Shops overstocking due to "sale or return" probably explains some of the difference, I know that Tesco had loads unsold when they finally removed them from the shelves in Feb/March this year and they probably sent 'em back for a refund. Decca should deduct returned CDs from their previous "sales" (shipments) totals but the wheels may turn quite slowly. Returned CDs is probably why the Classic FM presenter announced a lower "sales" figure of 1.9M at ClassicAlive than last year's figure of over 2M. Also, not all the returns may have been deducted when Decca did their last estimate, perhaps in the USA where I think the demand for Pure was greatly overestimated (by all of us). Another reason is that official charts company sales figures may not include everything. Exports and Record/CD Club sales (if the club rules don't suit the charts companies), may not be included. So the true figures for sales to the public are probably somewhere in between the two sets of figures, albeit much closer to the lower figures than the higher ones usually quoted by record companies. I was put on my guard when in January 2004, Decca was quoted as saying that Pure had sold "700,000" and then "nearly three-quarters of a million" copies in 2003 in the UK. Eventually, I discovered that the exact sales figure from the Official Charts Company was 578,749, for 2003. That's a 21% to 29% difference (depends how you interpret the record company quotes) and it took over a year to actually sell the extra CDs to the public. So I now take record company sales figures with a dash of scepticism unless they are specific about what they mean, or are confirmed from an independent source. Record Companies don't lie, they just love to quote big numbers!
|
|
|
Post by roger on Apr 14, 2005 19:21:26 GMT
Specialists like HMV still stock Pure, don't they? They certainly had 7 or 8 when I was last in HMV in Oxford Street, London about two weeks ago - far fewer than they used to have. I haven’t seen it anywhere else for two or three months. No doubt you can order it but it doesn’t appear on the shelves any more. That’s a pity because, when the DVD begins to sell well, it could give Pure that extra little boost but many people may not bother if they have to order it. BTW. I have an extra copy of Pure. Did you count that one? LOL Roger
|
|
Joe
Administrator
Supporting Hayley since 2003!
Posts: 6,701
|
Post by Joe on Apr 15, 2005 3:33:18 GMT
Yes...well done Dave. I always find your charts and number-crunching very informative. I reckon you would give that BBC guy Peter Snow and his election swingometer lark a run for his money!
|
|
|
Post by Richard on Apr 15, 2005 15:30:30 GMT
To Dave and Roger! There are still plenty of copies of the bonus CD edition of "Pure" in HMV and Virgin Megastores in Central London. The Virgin Megastore in Oxford Street has "Pure" at no.9 in their Classical Chart. Don't forget, I've got FOUR different versions of it, and I won't be putting any of them on E-bay! i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gifBye for now, Richard
|
|
Dave
Administrator
HWI Admin
Posts: 7,689
|
Post by Dave on Jul 15, 2005 18:42:50 GMT
Annual Worldwide Album SalesHmmm... I see I haven't done a "Hayley" sales update for three months... and with less than a month to go before the first releases of "Odyssey", I'd better get on with it! In the meantime, I can whet your appetites with a list of the top ten Countries of the World (+ NZ & Ireland) for numbers of CD albums sold in a year. The latest figures I have are for the year 2003, which is when the UK overtook Japan for the first time. Total Album Sales (CD) in 2003Rank | Country | Sales pa (millions) | Population (millions) | CD spend per person (US$) | 1. | U.S.A. | 746 | 294 | 40 | 2. | U.K. | 234 | 59 | 54 | 3. | Japan | 206 | 128 | 38 | 4. | Germany | 147 | 83 | 25 | 5. | France | 118 | 60 | 35 | 6. | Brazil | 58 | 179 | _ 2 | 7. | Spain | 54 | 41 | 15 | 8. | Mexico | 53 | 103 | _ 3 | 9. | Canada | 53 | 31 | 21 | 10. | Australia | 53 | 20 | 34 | 32. | Ireland | 7 | 4 | 32 | 34. | New Zealand | 7 | 4 | 28 |
I think the table helps to explain why Decca put so much effort into marketing Hayley in the UK, and last year, in the US as well. It's also easy to see why they ignore Brazil and Mexico! The figures were published recently on the Official Japan Record Industry website. Oooh look, my first ever table worked! i.postimg.cc/9fYxy370/smilie-big-grin.gifDave
|
|
|
Post by emmettb on Jul 15, 2005 18:48:13 GMT
Very interesting Dave, good totals there for Canada and Australia considering their populations. What happened to NZ??
Also, do you have any figures for Ireland Dave??
Cheers,
Emmett
|
|