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Post by larryhauck on Feb 13, 2011 0:50:52 GMT
I’m sorry you find this discussion boring, Larry but you don’t have to read it if you don’t wish to. I would like to point out that nobody is trying to speculate; that is not the purpose of this discussion. I merely invited members to offer their opinions as to which direction they think may be of benefit to Hayley’s career. With respect, I don’t believe it is your place to tell other members what they can and can’t post to this site. I had hoped to respond to a few other comments that have been made since my last visit but, in view of the above, perhaps I had better refrain. Hi Joe You're absolutely right I don't have to read them. And I seldom do. So I guess when there's not much else going on some may find them interesting. MY BAD Larry Hi Larry It was xanadu66 who said that you didn't have to read these posts, not me. Best wishes, Joe Well xanadu66 don't let me cramp your style if you want to say something regarding a thread or post go ahead. Larry
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Post by comet on Feb 13, 2011 3:07:01 GMT
I see some of you guys are getting a bad dose of cabin fever while waiting for Hayley's new album
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Post by spiderman on Feb 13, 2011 5:03:25 GMT
that sums it up rather well; unfortunately, it will distract us from our real purpose [or rather them, since im far too ? to be distracted {what word does one use when one doesnt want to say obsessed??}] and some of us probably wont notice hayley's new album. the spiderman
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Post by larryhauck on Feb 14, 2011 4:32:50 GMT
Hi Paul I'm worried that I won't live long enough for the release. But I won't die until it comes out. You American Pal Larry
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Post by mihizawi on Feb 18, 2011 23:01:03 GMT
Hey, guys, you always find things to discuss about while Hayley is on vacation... IIt took my quilte a while to get my way through this one.
Well, even though she is back and that means more interesting things to talk about coming soon, I hope you don't mind me giving my poiunt of view here...
Hmm... So many have been said here, I will only touch some aspects... First, the which direction question? Well, I am with Roger-G here, who knows what she wants? A good manager talks to the jmanaged person, ask him what are his goals and guides that person in that direction.It's the manager working for the managed, not the opposite. So, whatever it is, I am sure we don't have to worry that much, Hayley is very clever and has got many years of experience in the business to know how to get what she wants and who to rely on for that.
Yes, I am sure there are things that, wherever Hayley wants to go, could have been done better, like the whole management of internet official thingies, for example the poor (and mostly not updated) content on her website, but then again, it's extremely common on any artists, and finding a decent official webpage with a good design and useful content is the exception, not the rule. I think in Hayley's case that's more than forgivable (and that's why we are here, aren't we?), knowing how busy Hayley usually is with many events, concerts, charities and other tasks, which all need to be set up by the management team, and if Hayley herself is such a busy person, we can imagine the amount of work her management does; I guess they simply don't have time for the internet thingy. Probably getting better and more innovative use of the net would certainly help raise her visibility and popularity, which I am sure Hayley would welcome at least up to a certain degree. However, I have the feeling (many of you will know better if I am right or not) that Hayley enjoys a lot her busy life so full of different events, and I kind of thing that keeping that possible has a higher priority to her than being more visible in the net or other media, and I am pretty sure that's possibly why things have gone this way. I believe if Hayley want things to be done other way, she will achieve it.
So... OMG, the US thing again? I don't know how many times this have been discussed. I am reticent about Hayley becoming big in the states, for I see (and I may be wrong, Larry, haven't been there) many more and much heavier sacrifices than in any other place (artistical freedom, heavy exposure to the media, even busier schedule with touring and always being under preassure from the American market in order to mantain popularity and sales), however if Hayley decided to give it a try, she would have my support, of course... But this time I've seen one of the nicest ideas you've guys had on that point: the guest tour orchestra seasons, I think is a great idea to target the right audience: among them there will always be few snobs who will run away from her "non-suitable and technically lacking" voice and way of singing, however those, besides being snobs are ignorants about what they think they are experts at, expecting a dramatic opera soprano in any classical concert with voice. However, I tend to believe those are rather few and most people who attend these concerts are true music lovers who enjoy quality and beauty, and are much more open then the few snobs.
Well, and although I have more things to say, I think I'll leave it for tomorrow, I am rather tired and I need some sleep... So, to be continued.
Michal
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Post by larryhauck on Feb 19, 2011 3:27:15 GMT
Hey, guys, you always find things to discuss about while Hayley is on vacation... IIt took my quilte a while to get my way through this one. Well, even though she is back and that means more interesting things to talk about coming soon, I hope you don't mind me giving my poiunt of view here... Hmm... So many have been said here, I will only touch some aspects... First, the which direction question? Well, I am with Roger-G here, who knows what she wants? A good manager talks to the jmanaged person, ask him what are his goals and guides that person in that direction.It's the manager working for the managed, not the opposite. So, whatever it is, I am sure we don't have to worry that much, Hayley is very clever and has got many years of experience in the business to know how to get what she wants and who to rely on for that. Yes, I am sure there are things that, wherever Hayley wants to go, could have been done better, like the whole management of internet official thingies, for example the poor (and mostly not updated) content on her website, but then again, it's extremely common on any artists, and finding a decent official webpage with a good design and useful content is the exception, not the rule. I think in Hayley's case that's more than forgivable (and that's why we are here, aren't we?), knowing how busy Hayley usually is with many events, concerts, charities and other tasks, which all need to be set up by the management team, and if Hayley herself is such a busy person, we can imagine the amount of work her management does; I guess they simply don't have time for the internet thingy. Probably getting better and more innovative use of the net would certainly help raise her visibility and popularity, which I am sure Hayley would welcome at least up to a certain degree. However, I have the feeling (many of you will know better if I am right or not) that Hayley enjoys a lot her busy life so full of different events, and I kind of thing that keeping that possible has a higher priority to her than being more visible in the net or other media, and I am pretty sure that's possibly why things have gone this way. I believe if Hayley want things to be done other way, she will achieve it. So... OMG, the US thing again? I don't know how many times this have been discussed. I am reticent about Hayley becoming big in the states, for I see (and I may be wrong, Larry, haven't been there) many more and much heavier sacrifices than in any other place (artistical freedom, heavy exposure to the media, even busier schedule with touring and always being under preassure from the American market in order to mantain popularity and sales), however if Hayley decided to give it a try, she would have my support, of course... But this time I've seen one of the nicest ideas you've guys had on that point: the guest tour orchestra seasons, I think is a great idea to target the right audience: among them there will always be few snobs who will run away from her "non-suitable and technically lacking" voice and way of singing, however those, besides being snobs are ignorants about what they think they are experts at, expecting a dramatic opera soprano in any classical concert with voice. However, I tend to believe those are rather few and most people who attend these concerts are true music lovers who enjoy quality and beauty, and are much more open then the few snobs. Well, and although I have more things to say, I think I'll leave it for tomorrow, I am rather tired and I need some sleep... So, to be continued. Michal Hi Michal I agree with your evaluation that the states are not an easy nut to crack. However that doesn't mean it's impossible. I've always said that to make it here you may have to compromise some of your values; but once you have established yourself you're free to do your own thing. Many artists, especially musicians play music that is not necessarily their bailiwick, but then they move into their specialty. I agree it's a compromise that an artist Ike Hayley should have to do this but the rewards are great enough to justify it if you want to make it big. Personally I'd have to think real hard before I made an effort in the states. Having said that I think Hayley would like to do it. She said in her book ,"In Her Own Words" that the US was the "Holy Grail" for recording artists. I think that an artist with the God given talent Hayley possesses does not necessarily owe the world anything. But I think that she as any artist would like to reach as many people as possible. It's really unfortunate that the US works that way but then again the rewards are substantial. I have visited your country and many continental European Countries and I think I like yours a lot more than some others. Not all others though. And I spent the most time in Barcelona and Majorca. Remember the words in the song, NEW YORK, as sung by the immortal,FRANK SINATRA,.............IF YOU CAN MAKE IT THERE YOU CAN MAKE IT ANYWHERE. Best Wishes Larry
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Post by Libby on Feb 19, 2011 6:41:05 GMT
In order to tour here, you don't necessarily have to deal with the media that much. So as far as that goes, she wouldn't necessarily have to worry about that so much. The classical artists over here just aren't talked or gossiped about that much. Even the Jackie Evancho excitement has died down. But I don't think she's lost any fans because of it.
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Post by Elliot Kane on Feb 22, 2011 4:56:18 GMT
Martin, All rather like doing a jigsaw without knowing where the pieces are supposed to go, isn't it? Still, on the bright side, we can surely all agree that Hayley's wonderful voice goes right at the heart of the picture *** Libby, I must admit, I hugely admire your dedication to Hayley! I think The Hobbit may be a good idea, and you're about four moves ahead of me! At least! If the sign of a truly great artist is the dedication of their fans, Hayley has surely arrived and then some! (And for the doubters, no, this is NOT sarcasm! Libby & I may not always agree, but I have to admire anyone with that degree of passion for any artist). And honestly, if Hayley DOES get to work on The Hobbit, I'm not sure you'd be wrong to claim some credit for it. Jackson has to get the idea from somewhere, after all...
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Post by Libby on Feb 22, 2011 7:28:29 GMT
Libby, I must admit, I hugely admire your dedication to Hayley! I think The Hobbit may be a good idea, and you're about four moves ahead of me! At least! If the sign of a truly great artist is the dedication of their fans, Hayley has surely arrived and then some! (And for the doubters, no, this is NOT sarcasm! Libby & I may not always agree, but I have to admire anyone with that degree of passion for any artist). And honestly, if Hayley DOES get to work on The Hobbit, I'm not sure you'd be wrong to claim some credit for it. Jackson has to get the idea from somewhere, after all... You can't imagine the excitement I feel when I think of her singing for the movie, and know that I had a part in it. Ever since I wrote that letter, I sometimes feel like I'm not entirely content unless I'm working on some new Hayley-related project like that. Last year I sent the letter to the Mormon tabernacle choir (very positive response there, too!), and this year it's her new management (Mormon TC and Japanese ice shows; no response yet). Now, my next mission is the local symphonies/orchestras (I think this was amptique's idea). I've been searching for orchestras for some of the major cities in my area, and even the eastern side of the state. Before I write to them, I'm going to see what Hayley's upcoming tour looks like. If there aren't very many U.S. dates, I'll write to them and suggest they do an evening of Ennio Morricone music, and invite Hayley to perform solos! Other American fans ought to do the same thing; I'd love to write to all the symphonies in the U.S., but there's an awful lot of them! Actually, a fan from North Carolina on the official forum said that Hayley was supposed to perform with the Charlotte Symphony several years ago, but it was cancelled! But now that she has some more classic/well-known music on her album (we assume so, anyway), this just might be the thing to get her over here.
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Post by Elliot Kane on Feb 22, 2011 8:45:04 GMT
Libby, You're right, I can't imagine the excitement you must feel, though I wish I could. From me - as I suspect is true of most people - the level of support my favourite artists can expect is that I buy their albums and talk enthusiastically about them with other fans (Online and off). Hopefully, sometimes, I even get to introduce new people to their music, which is great. But you just take that to a whole other level!
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Post by Libby on Feb 23, 2011 1:05:44 GMT
Well, I don't often get much chance to share Hayley's music directly to people, in person, although I'd like to. But I did manage to get one of my friend's attention when I posted a youtube video of Never Saw Blue on Facebook. I doubt he ever bought a CD or anything, but at least he knows who she is, and was very impressed by what little he did hear. But this stuff would reach a lot more people at one time, so I wouldn't feel too bad about not having a chance to share with one or two people once in a while. Sometimes with that excitement comes the worry that it might not happen, after all! Well, at least one of the things ought to!
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Post by Elliot Kane on Feb 23, 2011 5:09:00 GMT
The amount of work you put in, Libby, something is bound to come up right, sooner or later. That's for sure!
All it takes is one e-mail or letter to hit at the right moment - and the odds are very much with you, there.
Every one of the people you write to is looking for the best possible way to entertain their target audience, after all.
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Post by martindn on Nov 25, 2011 21:41:31 GMT
This post and Peter's reply have been moved to this thread by Richard.I have now picked up on the detail of The Dominion report. To some extent I am working backwards because my earlier report in this frame of mind was based on the Southland Times report which I happened to read first. I will pick an extract from The Dominion. "Hayley's style was professional and classic. Her dresses were peach, red, and purple and her shoes were skyscrapers. Best moment: losing her heels to pedal press her way through Joni Mitchell's River at the piano. The interpretation was honest and her lyrically-led piano playing directed the rhythm. It worked. I would have liked to see her break into more of the passion-fuelled performances like that of Kate Bush's Wuthering Heights. But then would that be Hayley? [Yes, of course it would be Hayley because that was Hayley doing just that!] She is no rock goddess, no opera diva, yet she is a star. Her eyes sparkled when she sang My Heart Belongs To You from her 2005 album Odyssey and her harmonies with talented tenor Chase Douglas were powerful. This ties in with the observations of The Southland Times. I don't want to repeat what I have already said there but I guess from your own comment you are perhaps holding back from being too affirmative in support for this kind of reporting and my own initial passing observation was likewise placid. I don't think that we, whom she knows love her for herself and have no axe to grind but in supporting what we believe is in her best interests should be reticent in holding back from debating the issues. I think she is at a cross-roads and in her next album she can afford to take a wrong turn for a short way, looking for time over the next decade to retrench if need be. Leading up to this tenth anniversary year, it would have been totally wrong to be over-adventurous. Now, she enters a new decade. This is the time to be adventurous all over again. The World is Still at her Feet but this is now a mature woman stepping onto it. What has been brought out by both these most recent reports is respect for her competence and acknowledgement that what she has achieved is significant but... Audiences do vary and a "mother's night out' over-weighted audience does have a dulling effect. She is right in being Hayley but wrong if she is forgetting that Hayley on stage can be a different person. Being a singer she is is not in the same situation as with acting, where actors are people and separately are completely different people on stage. By the nature of singing, she is herself on stage but that does not stop her ability to switch from being herself and adopting, for a particular song a different persona, as she does with "Wuthering Heights" to varying degrees. In perhaps the middle one of her three costume changes she could be a totally different character, that would make a clear change yet leaving the opening and closing as classic Hayley. Is it possible that her orchestral tour in the UK could be a new presentation opportunity for the future? Although The Dominion reporter wrote what so many of us have previously written in the UK, "We just wish she'd forget the band and do without them and the mike!" She has always had competent backup, so competent that the backup has been good enough to make their own way subsequently. She has also been well backed by competent arrangers and good arrangement is often more important than a good song! An orchestra provides a wider support opportunity and maybe this would be the way for her to push out the boat with a greater diversity of interpretation. As regards the mike, that is treading dangerous ground. In the UK the amplification experience has improved considerably and it is standard practice for ordinary stage performances in the West End to be radio-miked--it is the strain of consistent demand over successive performances. Likewise, Opera divas sing periodically but it still comes down to physique. It is a balancing act of multiple variants. Only she can do the balancing. I think on Paradiso, and Hayley confirms this, Morricone masterminded everything, and Hayley just went along with his ideas. Nothing wrong with that, Ennio is a legend after all, and he did a great job. But he is not present at the live shows, and the arrrangements of his songs have been somewhat different I believe, since she has been performing with a band rather than an orchestra (correct me if I am wrong, that was certainly the case at Kings Lynn, and these concerts seen to have been very similar). And some of the songs on Paradiso I can't imagine would work with a band. If I look back at what I enjoy most about Hayley's music, it is Hayley. Might seem obvious I know, but Hayley's concerts are all about Hayley, and the more involvement she has, the more I like it. I love to hear her sing unaccompanied, and I love it when she accompanies herself on the piano. Those are highlights of any show for me. I love her own song compositions too. She does none of those things on Paradiso (although she did contribute some lyrics). So I understand it when that review says she doesn't need the band. But doing a whole concert unaccompanied, or with only her own accompaniment is something I don't think Hayley is ready for yet. Yet for me the music that she does perform is varied and interesting. So are these reviewers saying that it is not varied enough? As always, her shows are built around that glorious voice, and I wouldn't want it any other way. That is what I go to hear. And Peter, I think you once wrote that you would be happy to hear her sing the telephone directory. That once again implies that the voice is all. Yet the criticisms, such as they are in the reviews, are never about her voice, but about her material. And really it boils down to whether or not the voice is enough. Strange, they (the critics) go to hear the voice, then criticise something else, the material. Perhaps that is because we cannot find anything to criticise in her actual performance, but need to find something to make their critical reviews err.. critical. As far as I know Hayley has rarely done a concert that was radically different from what she has done before. She has always evolved, tweaking a few things here and there from her previous performance, but mostly doing the same thing. (West Side Story is the only exception I can think of in a live performance). She repeats what has worked for her before, and it slowly evolves. The 10 year homecoming aspect of the NZ tour means she sings a selection of songs from the whole of her career. It remains to see how much things will change with her UK Paradiso tour. With "I Dreamed a Dream", she goes right back to her first commercially released album "Hayley Westenra". And she sings it better than ever. But there are also songs from Paradiso, and everything between. I think that must be the thrust of what this tour is about. Her UK tour on the other hand, will be mostly about Paradiso I expect (and hope) and will feature many more of the songs from that album. If that is so, and with a full orchestra, it will be different from anything she has done before. In a way though, the Paradiso episode, much as I love it, is a bit of a sideways step for Hayley as an artist. Perhaps a necessary one, and I think one that has helped her development as an artist enormously, but also one where she delegated (if that is the right word) the control of her artistic direction to someone else. She did this too to an even greater extent with Celtic Woman of course. That is a very useful thing, since she has learned a lot by doing it. She now has more techniques that she can use. But as a fan, I love it when the artistic direction comes from Hayley herself, and I would like to think her own development in songwriting in particular, will be reawakened in her next album. Well, I'll post it here, but since I got a bit carried away, I'm not sure it is in the right thread. Martin D
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Post by postscript on Nov 25, 2011 22:50:50 GMT
I think Martindn that we need to leave it to the mods to sort out. There may already be somewhere a "Hayley's Development" or "Next Steps" thread. I started using the threads of the two latest concerts because it was they that started me off but I think any replies following on from then, as you have, should be allocated differently.
My personal feeling is that the NZ tour is something of a mixed bag. Timing is such that Paradiso has to be included but it is also celebrating ten years and so other things have to come into play. I think you raise an interesting point that the orchestral tour may well concentrate on Paradiso, although perhaps too late to push it for the April Awards frame. It will be interesting to learn what precisely the intention is and what is planned to follow after March and where?
I wonder if there could be a serious intent to major the States? The effect of Katherine Jenkins onslaught (unless there is more in the pipeline) will be tiring and there is likely to be a certain dulling effect of the delight in Jackie Evancho. An orchestral tour could well create that extra frisson that would draw attraction. While Morricone's orchestration is key I think the advantage of an orchestra, bearing in mind people will not want a concert version of the CD they have already bought, is the diversity of arrangements that can be presented. Why not also include Horner and the girl whose name escapes me, who composed a new version of "A Child's Guide to the Orchestra"?
I think those who criticise the danger of sameness fail to recognise the deep subtleties in a lot of what Hayley does. It is not her style to shout at the audience but to deliver quietly with nuance. I also think that she ought to include some of her Japanese stuff, in fact it is generally not appreciated how extensive are her language skills. I think her next album should be world ranging and that concept ought to be brought into her concert programme.To do that properly does require an orchestra and if she is going to have one she should make full use of it in all the opportunities it presents.
Peter S.
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Post by Richard on Nov 26, 2011 8:28:34 GMT
I think Martindn that we need to leave it to the mods to sort out. There may already be somewhere a "Hayley's Development" or "Next Steps" thread. I started using the threads of the two latest concerts because it was they that started me off but I think any replies following on from then, as you have, should be allocated differently. Hello Peter! I agree, so I've moved the two posts above to this thread. Richard
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